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What I have posted in response to the Credo
of "101 reasons why baptism does not save."
QUOTING
CHRIST
IN
THE
PROPHETS
IS NOT REFERRING TO LUCIFER. The true adversary is "he that
believeth not" and is therefore "baptized not" and therefore damned.
Isaiah from the Dead Sea Scrolls: The eunuch was reading this when he
heard about Jesus as the Messiah. He wanted to be baptized immediately.
Those of faith will never haggle with Jesus Christ because they are not
of faith and not because "Lucifer made them do it."
19. [+of iniquity+] (16)
Wash and make
yourselves clean and turn away the evil of your habitual practices from before
my eyes, stop doing evil. (17)
Learn
20. to do well, pursue
judgement, bless the oppressed, judge the
orphan, contend for the widow. (PP)
21. Please come and let us
reason together says YHWH,
if your sins
are like scarlet they shall be white as snow
22. if they be as red as
crimson they shall be as wool.
(19) If
you are obedient and you give heed
then of the good of the
Land [{you shall eat.}]
23. (20) But if you refuse
and you rebel
you
will
be
devoured
by
the sword because the mouth of YHWH has said it.
Refuse to obey is
Provoco 2.
In
jurid. lang., to take a cause before a higher court, to
appeal, make an appeal; A. To challenge to a
contest, to contend with, emulate, rival, vie
with
YOU WILL BE Devoro D.
Of property, to consume, to waste, = exhaurire: omnem pecuniam publicam,
C. ejus oratio,
nimia
religione attenuata,
a multitudine et a foro devorabatur, qs. swallowed but not digested
(i.
e.
heard
without
being understood),
bibrōskō ,
tōn melōn bebrōkotes Ar.V.463; Hom.
Od. 2.177
Aristoph.
Wasps 461
Bdelycleon
[460] There, we were
bound to drive you off sooner or later!
Eh! by Zeus! you would not have put
them to flight so easily if they had fed on the verses of Philocles.
Chorus
It is clear to all the poor that tyranny has [465] attacked us sorely.
Proud
emulator of Amynias, you, who only take pleasure in doing ill,
see how you are preventing
us from obeying the laws of the city;
you do
not even seek a pretext or any plausible excuse, [470] but claim to rule alone.
Hom. Od. 2.177 not Telemachus
for all his many words,nor do we reck of any
soothsaying which
thou, old man, mayest declare; it will fail of
fulfillment, and thou shalt be hated the more. Aye, and his possessions
shall be devoured in evil wise,
nor shall requital ever be made, so
long as she shall put off the Achaeans
WISE: Sophos A.
[select] skilled in any handicraft or art, clever,
harmatēlatas s. Pi.P.5.115, cf. N.7.17; kubernētēs A.Supp.770; mantis Id.Th.382;
Manti^s , o(, gen. eōs, Ion. ios; voc. manti^: pl., gen. manteōn (written manteion IG12.503); dat. A.
mantesi Thgn.545: also fem., acc. sg. mantida daphnēn App.Anth.6.122; nom. pl. mantides Suid.s.v. Sibulla: diviner, seer, prophet, all' age dē tina m. ereiomen ē hierēa ē kai oneiropolon Il.1.62, cf. Od.17.384;
Plat. Phaedrus 244b and the priestesses at Dodona when they have been mad have conferred many splendid benefits upon Greece
both in private and in public affairs,
but few or none when they have
been in their right minds;
and if we should speak of the Sibyl and all
the others
who by prophetic inspiration have foretold many things
to
many persons and thereby made them fortunate afterwards,
anyone can see
that we should speak a long time.
And it is worth while to adduce also
the fact that those men of old who invented names thought that madness
was neither shameful nor disgraceful;
Sibull-a , Sibyl, Heraclit.92, Ar.Pax 1095,1116, Pl.Phdr. 244b. Early writers only recognize
A.
one Sibyl (Sibullai kai Bakides, Arist.Pr.954a36, is no exception), first localized at Erythrae or Cumae, Id.Mir.838a6; later, others are mentioned, cf. Str.14.1.34, Paus.10.12.1 sqq., Sch.Pl.l.c., Buresch Klaros p.120. [Sibilla IG22.1534.85 (iv B.C.).]
Paul warned about women getting involved in religious rituals or effeminate males:
Lucian noted that "no
sacrifices were offered in Delos without round dances and the playing of
flutes and the
lyre.
(Lucian De saltations 16)The eloborate musical embellishment of
ritual in the cult
of
Apollo at Delphi
and
Delos was the reason for the choice of this deity as the parton of singers
and
poets. The playing
of
flute, syrinx, and lyre is further attested for a special rite of
sacrifice in use in greek worship since earliest times..
Lucian could be describing the attempt of Jezebel's
prophetesses when
he
described the priests
of
Cybele or Galloi.
"The unfortunate
people mutilate
themselves and beat each other
on the
back. A great
crowd
standing nearby accompanies them with flute music, the clashing
of cymbals or the ecstatic singing of holy songs.
- All this occurs,
however, outside
the temple.
- Those who are occupied
with such actions do
not go inside.
In these days the number of
the Galloi is increasing. For when the others play
the flute
and celebrate their orgies
the frenzy
falls on many who
have come only as
spectators.
A young man seized by this madness rips the clothing from his body and
dashes into the middle with a loud cry and, snatching one of the
swords that stands ready for just such a purpose, he castrates himself." (Lucian, De Dea Syria 50)
See Gregory Nazianzen Oration XXXIX to see the absolute musical worship and abnormal sexual connection which Paul identifies in Galatians 5.
Baptism promises us A holy spirit
or A
good conscience, consciousness or a co-perception of the word.
Paul told the Jews in Corinth that they had been made deaf at Mount
Sinai and would not be able to read BLACK
text on BROWN
paper until they turned, converted or were baptized into Christ.
If you refuse and rebel or
"believeth not" you will be
devoured by the Scribes and Pharisees Jesus
called hypocrites. In the Ezekiel 33 version hypocrites are for-hire
ORATORS, singers and instrument players. Even if they could speak the
truth you would not be able to READ or HEAR the Word being PREACHED by
being READ each rest day.
Jesus spoke of the
COMMON
TREASURY "collection plate" which was the:
Gazophulakion
(g1049) gad-zof-oo-lak'-ee-on; from 1047 and 5438; a
treasure-house, i.e. a court in the temple for the collection-boxes: - treasury
And he said unto
them in his doctrine, Beware of the scribes,
which
love
to
go in long
clothing, and love salutations
in the market places, Mark
12:38
And the chief seats
in the synagogues, and the
uppermost rooms at feasts: Mark 12:39
Which devour
widows
houses, and for a
pretense make long prayers: these shall receive greater damnation.
Mark 12:40
To
devour is the Greek:
2719. katesthio,
kat-es-thee΄-o; from 2596 and 2068 (including its alternate); to
eat
down, i.e. devour (literally or figuratively)
To be consumed is:
355. analisko, from the
alternate of 138; properly, to use up, i.e. destroy:
consume.
138
is
the word heresy. Having the same meaning as
aresko or SELF-pleasure Paul consigned to the marketplace in Romans 14
and outlawed when he defined the assembly or synagogue in Romans 15.
42. airo,
ah΄-ee-ro;
a
primary root; to lift up; by implication, to take
up or away; figuratively, to raise (the voice), keep in
suspense (the mind), lift up, loose, make to doubt, put
away, remove, take (away, up).
-Aeiro, raise up, instruments
or machinery in the theater,
to
bear a burden, raise a tax, exhalt, passion
and pride, excite, raise UP by praise, exaggerate, lift up to
remove, raise up a cheer, ai. mēkhanēn, in the theatre, Antiph.191.15; so epi tas mēkhanas katapheugousi theous airontes 4. take up and bear,
as
a burden, moron A.Pers.547; athlon S.Tr.80; algos A.R.4.65. esp. of pride
and passion, exalt, excite, hupsou ai. thumon grow excited, S.OT914;
1 Corinthians 6.[15] Don't
you know that your bodies are
members of Christ? Shall I then take the members of Christ, and make
them members of a prostitute? May it never be!
An
approved example in the definition:
Aristophanes,
Knights
507 Had one of
the old authors asked me to mount this stage to recite his
verses, he would not have found it hard to persuade me. But our poet of
to-day is likewise worthy of this favour; Often
enough
had
he triumphed over his rivals; he had sung in
all keys, played the lyre and fluttered wings;
he
turned
into
a Lydian
and even into a gnat, daubed himself with green to
become a frog. All
in vain! When young, you applauded him; [525] in his old age
you hooted
and mocked him, because his genius for raillery had gone.
Those having been taken captive in such a cult will defend their captor
to the death.
JESUS
MAKING
THAT
PROPHECY
MORE PERFECT.
Mark 16:15 And he said unto
them,
Go ye into all the world, and preach
the gospel to every creature.
Mark 16:16 He that believeth and is baptized shall be
saved;
but he that believeth not shall be damned
I didn't say that: Lucifer didn't say that: Christ in the Prophets and
Jesus who made the prophecies more perfect.
Isaiah is the prophecy by
Christ. "if you refuse and rebel" is the same as "he that believeth
not" whichis the Greek Apistos. Christ says those who rebel are
traitors: I didn't say that but the masses of people who are CALLED
will not be of the few CHOSEN which means "tested and selected."
The usual theology is that Mark 16 does not say that "he that believeth
not and IS NOT baptizedshall be damned." However, the Greek
Apostos or "believeth not" has the same meaning as verse 23 above: If
you REFUSE and REBEL you will be damned.
The typical
Scribal or "doctor of the law" method is to look up all of the "saved"
words and use them to force the Bible and all early history to lie.
The people "believeth not" what Noah preached. Believeth not means to
be DISOBEDIENT.
1 Pet. 3:20 Which sometime were disobedient,
apeith-eō
, Att. form of api^theō
(though even Trag. preferred apisteō,
q.v. 11), A.
to be disobedient, refuse compliance
Apisteo
I. disbelieve, distrust, II.
= apeitheō,
disobey, to be disobedient, tois apistousin tade in
these things, S.Ant.219, cf. 656; ēn d' apistōsi
but if they refuse to comply, E.Supp.389, cf. Pl.Lg.941c. 2.
to be faithless, ei hēmeis apistoumen, ekeinos pistos menei 2
Ep.Tim. 2.13.
2 Timothy 2.[12] If we endure, We will also reign with him.
If we deny him, He also will deny
us
2 Timothy 2.[13] If we are faithless,
He remains faithful. He can't
deny himself.
when once the longsuffering of God waited in the
days of Noah,
while the ark was a preparing, wherein few, that is,
eight souls were
saved by water.
Baptism is imitating that
event which is a "pattern capable of being imitated."
1 Pet. 3:21 The like figure (Antitupon
or Antitype counterpart) whereunto
..even baptism doth also
now save us (not the
putting away of the filth of the flesh,
..but the answer
of [Appeal FOR not PLEDGE] a good conscience
toward God,)
..by the
resurrection of Jesus Christ:
But God be thanked,
that ye were the servants of sin,
but ye have obeyed from the heart that form
(tupos a
model for imitation) of doctrine
which was delivered you. Ro 6:17
But now being
made free from sin, and
become servants to God, ye
have your fruit
unto holiness, and
the end
everlasting life. Ro 6:22
2 Thess 3:9 Not because we have not
power,
but
to make ourselves an ensample unto you to follow us.
Anti (g473) an-tee'; a prim. particle; opposite, i.e. INSTEAD
or
because of (rarely in addition to): - for,
in the room of.
Often used in composition to denote contrast, requital, SUBSTITUTION,
correspondence,
etc.
- We are baptized by GRACE instead of having to
build an Ark or drown
- We are baptized by GRACE instead of having to
cross the
Red Sea or be destroyed by FAITH ONLY when God said "Quit whining, lift
up your arm and MOVE into the jaws of death.
- We are baptized by GRACE instead of having to
be
pinned
on
a stake and shed OUR blood.
When you
have to EXPLAIN AWAY what the text MAKES CLEAR you may have exhausted
God's Grace.
Tupos
(g5179) too'-pos; from 5180; a die (as struck), i.e.
(by impl.) a stamp or scar; by anal. a shape, i.e. a statue, (fig.)
style or resemblance; spec. a sampler ("type"), i.e. a model (for
imitation) or instance (for warning): - en- (ex-) ample, fashion,
figure, form, manner, pattern, print.
Maybe YOU can be SAVED without the REMISSION OF SINS (connected only to
baptism) but I DON'T THINK you can go into the Most Holy Place wearing
DIRTY CLOTHES. Paul says we are saved BY FAITH when we are
BAPTIZED to be CLOTHED with Christ. Then we have A holy spirit
translated into heaven WHEN we are added to the CHURCH which is AFTER
we have been baptized.
To the general assembly
and church of the
firstborn, which are
written in heaven, and to God the Judge of all,
... and to the Spirits of
just men made
perfect, Heb 12:23
They challenge: No, God saved these
people and obedience was not demanded. Did God force them
to DISOBEY? No. They lost
themselves because they were disobedient. They were saved by
water because that was the instrumental
means
that God choose. Grace teaches and provides the
means: there is no grace to those who deny that Christ has any power to
bestow in baptism.
FAITH means NOT arguing with God! They were saved IN the Ark and saved
BY the Water because THAT is how God planned to do it. If Noah had
whinned, we would ALL be Cainites or Kenites who DID survive the flood.
We also quoted Jesus calling those who did not comply with "he that
believeth and is baptized shall be saved" He calls APISTOS. Based
on Jesus' words this is a
public confession which says I WILL
NOT COMPLY WITH ANYTHING other than
your grace and my faith.
I assuredly did not say anything that Jesus did not say: Jesus called
the Scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites:
in
the
Ezekiel
33
version
Christ
named rhetoricians, singers and instrument players. Music from mystery
means "to make the lambs dumb before the slaughter" or "to silence the
voice of the victim" and was therefore called "sacred violence." God
HIDES Himself from the wise or
SOPHISTS including
speakers, singers,
instrument players, actors and all of the hypocritic arts and crafts.
Woe
unto you,
lawyers for ye have
taken away the key of
knowledge:
ye entered
not
in yourselves, and
them that were entering in ye
hindered. Lu.11:52
And
all the people that heard
him, and the publicans,
justified God,
being
baptized with the baptism of
John. Luke 7:29
But
the Pharisees and lawyers rejected
the counsel of God against themselves,
being
not
baptized of
him. Luke 7:30
Grace 101a does not
mean that I
claim people are under the power of Lucifer because they disagree with
ME. Rejected has the same meaning as "believeth nor" or Apistos
which
brings on wrath. I am posting the links for those who want to be saved
from "believeth nots"
Being baptizes is the CHRIST
ORDAINED way to "justify" God: God has the authority to save and the
authority to say how. If you question baptism you say to God that
He does NOT have any authority over your life.
di^kai-oō
, 3. pronounce and treat
as righteous, justify, vindicate, LXXEx.23.7, Je.3.11; heautous
Ev.Luc.16.15,
etc.:freq. in Pass., ib.7.35, etc.
Luke 16.14] The Pharisees,
who were lovers of money, also
heard all
these things,
and they scoffed at him. (mocked,
ridicule, laughed to scorn)
Luke 16.[15] He said to them,
"You
are those who justify yourselves in
the
sight
of
men,
but God knows
your hearts.
For that which is exalted among
men
is an abomination in
the sight of God.
Those who refused to be baptized say that God HAS NO RIGHT to demand
that they be baptized. The meaning is the same as Apistos or
"believeth not."
Athet-eō
, athetos)
A. set at
naught a treaty, promise,
etc., pistin Plb. 8.36.5; thusian
LXX 1 Ki.2.17; diathēkēn
Ep.Gal.3.15; theon 1 Ep.Thess. 4.8; sumphōnon
OGI444.18
(Ilium); deny, disprove, talēthes
Phld.Rh. 1.5 S., cf. Sign.37
(Pass.):Pass., to be struck off a register, PTeb.74.29 (ii B. C.); to be rejected, of a petition, POxy.1120.8(iii
A. D):Astrol., cancel, render ineffectual, Vett.Val.115.3,
cf.
105.8 (Pass.). |
| Gal. 3:26 For ye are all the children of God
by faith in Christ Jesus.
Gal. 3:27 (What
I mean to say is) as many of you as have been baptized
into Christ have put on Christ.
27] quicumque enim in Christo baptizati estis Christum
induistis
Enim
why because, for, for instance, namely,
that
is to say, I mean, in fact I.
To corroborate a preceding assertion,
yes indeed, yes truly, of a
truth, to be sure, certainly, indeed: A. To prove or show the grounds
of a preceding assertion
We are children of
God BY faith, "what I mean is" those who have been baptized into Christ
have put on Christ.
Literary example
Cic.
Off.
1.39
13.
Again, if under
stress of circumstances
individuals have made any promise to the enemy,
they are bound to keep their word even then.
For
instance, in the First
Punic War, when Regulus was
taken prisoner by the Carthaginians, he was sent
to Rome on parole to negotiate an exchange of
prisoners;
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2. c.dat., refuse
one's
assent, tois hupo Timaiou eirēmenois
Plb.12.14.6.
3. deal
treacherously with,
break faith with, tina Plb.9.36.10, LXX Is.1.2,
II. Gramm., reject as
spurious, D.H. Din.9, D.L.7.34, etc.
III. abs., to
be
unsuitable,
unfit, Diph. 1 D
1 Thessalonians 4.7 For God
called us not for uncleanness, but in sanctification.
1 Thessalonians 4.[8] Therefore
he who rejects doesn't reject man,
but God, who has
also given his Holy Spirit to you.
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These
words spake his parents,
because they feared the Jews:
for the Jews had agreed already,
that if
any man did confess
that he was Christ,
he
should be put out of the
synagogue.
Jn.9:22
Nevertheless
among the chief
rulers also many believed on him;
but
because of the
Pharisees they did not
confess him,
lest they
should be put out of the synagogue: Jn.12:42
For
they loved the
praise of men more than the praise of God. John 12:43
He that
believeth NOT
shall be damned, says Jesus Christ: If you refused to comply with "he
that believeth AND is baptized shall be damned" I do not say that you
are under the control of Lucifer.
Apistos
, on,
I. Pass., not
to be trusted, and so:
1. of persons and their acts,
by untrustworthy, groundless confidence, Th.1.120; shifty,
unreliable, Pl.Lg.775d.
II. Act., mistrustful, incredulous, suspicious,
thumos de toi aien a.
Of course, they were saved by GOD but not WITHOUT faith,
obedience, getting into the COFFIN (not a boat) covered with blood-red
bitumen inside and out, and was high and dry while the OLD MAN OF SIN
was drowned. Remember that Peter said SAVE YOURSELVES from this CROOKED
GENERATION. That points to the perverted skolion new wineskinners.
They were saved BY the Water because the water DROWNED "sin" and lifted
them OUT or ABOVE the waters which drown.
Baptism is like God, the Ark and the Water: it was given POWER by Faith
which worked. God's power is always VESTED in something.
Heb 11:7 By faith Noah, being warned of
God of things not seen as yet,
moved with fear,
prepared an ark to the saving of his house;
by the which he condemned the world,
and became heir of the righteousness which is by
faith.
It is true, Baptism is the SEAL that Christ has given us A holy spirit
and at the same time condemns those who refuse to comply or "believeth
not." |
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