New Winskins, Jay Guin: Reflections on My Interview with Rick Atchley and Chris Seidman


5.02.11 See Danny Dodd and Royce Ogle on Legalism

John T. Willis 2. "Sing" is vocal; "make melody" is instrumental. Psalms 33:2-3; 144:9; 149:1, 3 make this crystal clear. Amos 5:23 further verifies this reality.  People forget that God turned Israel over to worship the starry host because of musical idolatry at Mount Sinai. The Levites were under the KING and the COMMANDERS of the army: they made war and not worship. We will examine these passages in context.

Many new notes added 4.17.11.  Jay is presenting his brief but utterly ignores the Scripture and recorded history.  Jesus said that doctors of the law take away the key to knowledge.


Jay Guin is a good lawyer: he has come up with a new foundational authority for instrumental music.  However, his premise that God commanded the king, kingdom, temple, animal sacrifices and the associated instrumental noise is wrong: there is no historic scholarship among the church fathers that God commanded that which was the result of "firing" God and demanding a human king.

by Jay Guin
September - December, 2010

Click for Jay Guin Reviews.


Christ the Spirit spoke through the Prophets
Jesus of Nazareth made these prophecies more perfect
Jesus said "my WORDS are Spirit and Life."
To speak out of your own imagination while pretending to speak for Christ is defined as blasphemy.

12.20.10 CLICK FOR The Future of the Progressive Churches of Christ: Christ in the prophets have given us an answer.

Should We Add Instrumental Worship 

The "Progressives" have no choice if Revelation 17-18 is being fulfilled as we listen.

Lots of scholarship attributes the giant outburst of gender confusion to the younger generation addicted to music all week long.  Plato warned that men who always performed the female roles in all religions, tend to become what they pretend to be. The Internet is filled with urgent warning about the absolute feminization of what we call church worship,

See the Late Roger Chambers on the gender conversion in the Christian Church.
Roger Chambers refutes Leroy Garrett the false father of the Stone-Campbell deception.

"The development both of religion and of the arts can be traced back in a continuous line to the hunting era. The group ritual of the primeval tribesmen were the origin not only of all religious ceremonial, but also of the drama and of poetry and music, while magic gave birth to the visual arts." (Parkes, Henry Bamford, On Gods and Men, p. 30).

"Awed by the mysteries of his own spirit no less than by those of nature, primitive man was likely to attribute to divine influence

any abnormal emotional state, whether above or below the usual level. Medicine men customarily went into states of trance in which they were believed to be in communication with the gods,

and many tribes supposed lunatics and sexual deviants to be divinely possessed.H. Bamford Parkes, Of God and Men.

Johannes Quasten. In Music and Worship in Pagan and Christian Antiquity, beginning on page 41:

History of Aesthetics p.224
Poledumus launched a polemical attack 1. against the allegation there there existed a specificic association between music and the soul. He stated bluntly that its effect on the soul is no different from the culinart, 2. against its alleged association with the deity, since the states of ecstasy brought about through listening to music are easily explained; 3. against its alleged elemental moral effects and its ability to strengthen or weaken virtue; 4. against its ability to express or represent anything and characters in particular.

"Philodemus considered it paradoxical that music should be regarded as veneration of the gods while musicians were paid for performing this so-called veneration. Again, Philodemus held as self deceptive the view that music mediated religious ecstasy.
He saw the entire condition
induced by the noise of cymbals and tambourines as a disturbance of the spirit.
        He found it significant that, on the whole,
only women and effeminate men fell into this folly.
nothing of value could be attributed to music;
        it was no more than a
slave of the sensation of pleasure,
        which satisfied much in the same way that food and drink did.

"It is no accident that a high proportion of those who suddenly show symptoms of being bewitched (such as fainting or going into a semi-trance) at 'squaw dances' or other large gatherings are women or men who are somewhat neglected or who occupy low social status.

In most of these cases it is probably not a matter of consciously capitalizing on the credence of their fellows in order to get the center of the stage for themselves.

It is unlikely that Navahos often deliberately complain of the symptoms of witchcraft as a device for getting attention. The process normally takes place at an altogether unconscious level:

those whose uneasiness
 beyond certain point have to do with something; and if they are believed to be at the
mercy of witches they are likely to get help." (Goldschmidt, Walter, Exploring the Ways of Mankind, p. 518, Holt, Rinehart and Winston)
Jay Guin: So the question must be asked: should our churches add instrumental services? Or is it good enough to remain a cappella? Well, what are the arguments pro and con?

In favor of exclusively a cappella worship —
  • Adding instrumental worship damns. (All recorded effort proves that it is a MARK)
  • Adding instrumental worship is sinful.
All we can know is in Scripture: Yes, musical instruments BECAUSE they can easily be sold to the lower classes as producing supernatural sounds. All pagans believed that the gods (demons) WERE the instrument or lived inside of the instrument. David wanted to  AWAKEN his lyre so he could awaken the dawn.  Many people baptized musical instruments and stored them in shrines.

Secondly, musical instruments IN FACT procued vibrations which "dithers" or confuses the mind as it uses all of its power trying to follow all of the complex sounds.  This is a medical fact and is proved to produce endorphins and other mind-altering chemicals.  These, in turn, create the impulses of Fight, Flight or sexual impulses. Loud music in fact vibrates all of the private parts and pleasure sensing nerve endings.

And instruments are DAMNING because they are proven to be the CAUSE of God abandoning those who simply are not OF FAITH or OF TRUTH..

The use of instruments to SILENCE the Word is defined over and over as something that DAMNS.  
The Church of Christ was NEVER instrumental: it did NOT divide OFF the instrumental sect. Calling it a divisive tradition or heresy is the sign of NEVER reading History. And music was always the mark or cause of the effeminate assemblies like the mad women in Corhith.  
All other religious groups were SECTARIANIZED when people IMPOSED instruments usually to fill up the unlawful and ungodly coffers.  
Jesus defined the Christian REST: Greek PAU0 this damnmed laded burdens and burden laders  
Jay's BRIEF is based on the CURSE of the Sacrificial system and EXORCISM sounds to make the lambs dumb before the slaughte: those PATTERNISTS were damned BECAUSE of musicall idolatry:  

Exod 31:12 And the Lord spake unto Moses, saying,  
Exod 31:13 Speak thou also unto the CHILDREN OF ISRAEL,  
        saying, Verily my sabbaths ye shall keep:  
        for it is a sign between me and you  
        throughout your generations; [your revolution of time]  
        that ye may know that I am the Lord that doth sanctify you

H2490 châlal khaw-lal' A primitive root (compare H2470 ); properly to bore, that is, (by implication) to wound, to dissolve; figuratively to profane (a person, place or thing), to break (one’s word), to begin (as if by an opening-wedge); denominatively (from H2485 ) to play (the flute):—begin (X men began), defile, X break, defile, X eat (as common things), X first, X gather the grape thereof, X take inheritance, pipe, player on instruments, pollute, (cast as) profane (self), prostitute, slay (slain), sorrow, stain, wound.
Jesus Died to give us REST the INSTRUMENTALISTS destroyed at Mount Sinai which damned them with no redemption.  
Exod 31:14 Ye shall keep the sabbath therefore; for it is holy unto you:  
    every one that DEFILETH (Music) it shall surely be put to death:  
    or whosoever doeth any work therein, that soul shall be cut off from among his people.  
8104. shamar, shaw-mar´; a primitive root; properly, to hedge about (as with thorns), i.e. guard; . 

Keep in Latin: Custodio II. With the access. idea of hindering free motion, A. In gen., to hold something back, to preserve, keep: To prevent PLAY or Ludo A. To sport, play with any thing, to practise as a pastime, amuse one's self with any thing, B. To sport, dally, wanton Esp., to play on an instrument of music, to make or compose music or song:

Pliny: When the Father commands us to read with attention or aloud we must keep in CUSTODY LUDIBAT 
The Sporting Peter warns about is LUDO or entrupo which parses to "playing musically or playing sexually." Caroll Wimber and Plato do not mince any words.

Custōdĭa , ae, f. id., I. a watching, watch, guard, care, protection (freq. and class.)


Poimēn , enos, o(, voc. poimēn (not -men) Hdn.Gr.2.717:—
A. herdsman, whether of sheep or oxen, Od.10.82-5, al.; opp. lord or owner (anax), 4.87.
2. in LXX and NT, pastor, teacher, Je. 2.8, Ep.Eph.4.11, etc. (Cf.Lith.piemuõ, piemeñs 'shepherd'.)

Pastor tam fida canum, Shepherds WATCH out for DOGS: in the church Paul EXCLUDED Dogs by demanding worship IN THE SPIRIT as opposed to IN THE FLESH.  Dogs were catamites or male prostitutes MARKED by their style of singing or howling as in CCM.  The elders turned Wolves are also Catamites and lovers of boys.  How better than to watch them arouse a whole congregation to a HIGH ENERGY LEVEL
(cănes , Plaut. Men. 5, 1, 18; id. Trin. 1, 2, 133;
fida canum vis,Lucr. 6, 1222: “levisomna canum fido cum pectore corda,id. 5, 864:
canibus circumdare saltus,Verg. E. 10, 57: “hos non inmissis canibus agitant,id. G. 3, 371: “leporem canibus venari,
Saltātĭo , ōnis, f. id.,
I. a dancing; concr., a dance, Quint. 1, 11, 18 sq.; 2, 18, 1; Scipio Afric. ap. Macr. S. 2, 10: “multarum deliciarum comes est extrema saltatio,Cic. Mur. 6, 13; id. Brut. 62, 225; id. Fin. 3, 7, 24; Quint. 11, 3, 128; Suet. Tit. 7 al.Plur., Plaut. Stich. 5, 2, 11.

In many of the Greek States the art of dancing was carried to great perfection by females, who were frequently engaged to add to the pleasures and enjoyment of men at their symposia. These dancers always belonged to the courtesans. Xenophon ( Symp.ix. 2-7) describes a mimetic dance which was represented at a symposium where Socrates was present. It was performed by a maiden and a youth, belonging to a Syracusan, who is called the orchêstodidaskalos, and represented the loves of Dionysus and Ariadné.
a. A shameless, vile person, Plaut. Most. 1, 1, 40; Ter. Eun. 4, 7, 33
Pl. Mos. 1.1 While you choose to, and have the opportunity, drink on, squander his property, corrupt my master's son, a most worthy young man, drink night and day, live like Greeks4, make purchase of mistresses, give them their freedom, feed parasites, feast yourselves sumptuously. Was it thus that the old gentleman enjoined you when he went hence abroad? Is it after this fashion that he will find his property well husbanded? Do you suppose that this is the duty of a good servant, to be ruining both the estate and the son of his master?
Scurra , 1. A city buffoon, droll, jester (usually in the suite of wealthy persons, and accordingly a kind of parasite; “syn.: sannio, parasitus): urbani assidui cives, quos scurras vocant, venustissimus inter rhetores scurra,Sen. Suas. 2, 12.—Of the clown in a pantomime, Juv. 13, 111

Dēlĭcĭae [delicio; that which allures, flatters the senses], delight, pleasure, charm, allurement; deliciousness, luxuriousness, voluptuousness, curiosities of art; sport, frolics, etc. (freq. and class.; for syn. cf.: voluptas, libido, delectatio, oblectatio, delectamentum, oblectamentum).
b. A fierce or enraged person, Plaut. Men. 5, 1, 14; 5, 1, 18; Hyg. Fab. 3; cf. Cic. Rosc. Am. 20, 57; Sen. Cons. Marc. 22, 5.—
2. As the regular designation of the hangers-on or parasites of an eminent or rich Roman; a follower, dog, creature:

The sacrificial instrument player in the Greek system was called a PARASITE: all musicians are parasites and contribute only entertainment.
2. The minister or superintendent of a church or congregation (eccl. Lat.): “pastores Israel,Vulg. Ezech. 34. 2: “pastores et doctores,id. Eph. 4, 11.—Esp., of Christ: “Ego sum pastor bonus,Vulg. Johan. 10, 11: “eduxit de mortuis Pastorem magnum,id. Heb. 13, 20;
OF THE GOATS AS BURNT OFFERINGS NOT COMMANDED BY GOD but used by Rick Atchley, Chris Seidman, all who IMPOSE the worship of the GOAT and Jay Quin who follows along.
Verg. G. 2.386
For no offence but this to Bacchus bleeds
The goat at every altar, and old plays
Upon the stage find entrance; therefore too
The sons of Theseus through the country-side—
Hamlet and crossway—set the prize of wit,

And on the smooth sward over oiled skins
Dance in their tipsy frolic. Furthermore
The Ausonian swains, a race from Troy derived,
Make merry with rough rhymes and boisterous mirth,

Grim masks of hollowed bark assume, invoke
Thee with glad hymns, O Bacchus, and to thee
Hang puppet-faces on tall pines to swing.
Hence every vineyard teems with mellowing fruit,

Till hollow vale o'erflows, and gorge profound,
Where'er the god hath turned his comely head.
Therefore to Bacchus duly will we sing
Meet honour with ancestral hymns, and cates
And dishes bear him; and the doomed goat
Led by the horn shall at the altar stand,
Whose entrails rich on hazel-spits we'll roast.
Rough translation: "When that father cervicibus to adhere to! when we female friend of a father and being loved and discreetly complectebatur! when food , when paedagogos , when praeceptores for to stitch whom courteously diligent! how eagerly, how intellegenter lectitabat! when moderately custoditeque ludebat! By which route that moderation, by which route patience  by which route as yet constancy novissimam valetudinem to have borne!

PERSECUTIONS ALWAYS COME TO THE BEAT OF MUSICAL DECEIVERS: Hang in there, you have not yet suffered like Jesus and Stephen for telling you the truth about the new restoration of the worship of the STARS.
        Acts 7:37 This is that Moses, which said unto the children of Israel, 
            A prophet shall the Lord your God raise up  [Suscito resurrect]
        unto you of your brethren,
        like unto me; him shall ye hear.
Acts 7:38 This is he, that was
        in the church in the wilderness 
        with the angel which spake to him in the mount Sina, and with our fathers: 
        who received the lively oracles to give unto us:
This was The Book of The Covenant of Grace: it's laws were conditional.
Acts 7:39 To whom our fathers would not obey, 
        but thrust him from them,
        and in their hearts turned back again into Egypt,
Acts 7:40 Saying unto Aaron, 
        Make us gods to go before us: for as for this Moses, 
        which brought us out of the land of Egypt, we wot not what is become of him.

Acts 7:41 And they made a calf in those days, 
        and offered sacrifice unto the idol, 
        and rejoiced in the works of their own hands.

Acts 7:42 Then God turned,
        and gave them up to worship the host of heaven;
        as it is written in the book of the prophets,
        O ye house of Israel,  have ye offered to me slain beasts and sacrifices
        by the space of forty years in the wilderness?
Acts 7:43 Yea, ye took up the tabernacle of Moloch
        and the star of your god Remphan, 
        figures which ye made to worship them: 
        and I will carry you away beyond Babylon.
The Ghebers of Hebron There was a line of "Highplaces" running from the pyramids of Gizeh through Philistia, Hainan,1 Salem, Shiloh, Beth Shems, Moab,—to Bel's Tower at Babylon. They were sacred to Bal or Bel (El) the Sun. In Syria, Moab, and Mesopotamia they built temples on elevations natural or artificial. Salamah is said to have built one bamah (highplace) to Ka- mos in Moab, and another to the " King" (Malak, Moloch) among the Ammonites. The bamoth were probably the oldest highplaces and temples of the Asarim, Asarielites, or Syrians. The Great Highplace was at Gabaon.2 There Bel- Saturn s met 4 his worshippers on Saturn's Day.

2 Hoaea, xii. 4 derives the name Inracl from Sarah to contend, to fight, and El = God of Fire name of the War god {Exodus, xiii. 21, 22, xiv. 25), Saturn and the Sun. The Fire-god Azar was the God of war, and M'irs was the Sun. — Macrob. I. xvii. OS
— Gen. xxxii. '28. Asarians, Asriel, Israel, a

But these fire-worshippers carried with them the arks of Moloch and Khiun (Life-god), their Adon, and they had, like the other peoples of the Delta, their Mysteries, which the priests instituted. They took with them from Phoenicia, probably, a certain knowledge of fixed vocal
signs; and it would not be safe to deny to Syria the possession of some sort of (Syrian) hieroglyphs

In the cuneiform writing the Jews were named laudi.— Schrader, Keilinschr. n. d. Alt. Test. 188. Audah, in Hebrew, means ' I will praise.' This reveals the original name of Ju- dea, the land of And. If we follow St. Jerome's dictum " to write a ' he' but to read it an «," we will find that Isaiah, xix. 17, has " laiidah's laud " instead of Jeudah's land. By a Hebrew pun, Genesis, xxix. 35, gives us ' Audah' as the root of the name laudah. Ami's altar was sprinkled with blood. Saturn's name was Chion, the Living One. Saturn's altars were blood-besprinkled. The √ of lachoh's (lao's) altars were blood-besprinkled on Saturn's day. The right ears of Aharon and his sons, their right thumbs, their right great toes, and their garments were sprinkled with blood.—Exodus, xxix. 12, 116, 20, 21. For the life of the flesh is in the blood.—Leviticus, xvii. G, 11. Chion was the Achiah asur Achiah, of Exodus, iii. 14, the Living God of Time, Set or Saturn. Compare Daniel, vii. 13. For Chion (like Moloch) was the name of the Living One!

We find the cities of the priests with the brothers (fratres) in their orders, in 2 Chronicles, xxxi. 15. A deity, regarded as the pure, holy fire, cannot be approached by the ordinary man; a priest-caste is requisite, to which the preservation of the sacred fire-place is entrusted, and which by mortifyings (of the flesh) and torments self-inflicted must make itself worthy of the access to the deity and its revelation. We find among the Old Canaanites no proper priesthood, but everywhere in Palestine, according to the Scriptural accounts, where the Chaldean fire-god Moloch

Dionysus was worshipped among the Old Kanaanites and Arabians—" where the Bacchic fire of the God leaps forth." This Fire is that of Bal Melkarth or Moloch. The worship of this Tyrian Fire-god Herakles (Archal) was carried to Tarz

1 Eiodus, xix. 10, 11, 18; 1 Samuel, xxi. 4, 5. The "bundle of life" with la'hoh (1 Sara. xxv. 29) is the union of the souls with Osiris! was adored.'

See the MARK of the BEAST below.

Only legalists need laws to PREVENT or to MARK them as the false teacher.

In the Bible and many contemporaneous Hebrew parallels, using INSTRUMENT to ELEVATE HIMSELF God Lucifer CAST AS PROFANE OUT OF HEAVEN.  He/she/it is called the singing and harp playing prostitute.  This uses a real "melody" word.

Matt. 11:16 But whereunto shall I liken this generation? It is like unto CHILDREN sitting in the markets, and calling unto their fellows, (That gender prophecy in Isaiah 3 which must be fulfilled as an attack on Jesus)

Latin (will show links in my review of Jay) [15] qui habet aures audiendi audiat [16] cui autem similem aestimabo generationem istam similis est pueris sedentibus in foro qui clamantes coaequalibusi

In Romans14 Paul outlawed the "doubtful disputations" or private opinions in speaking, singing, playing instruments, selling bodies or the MEATS which would be an issue only in the MARKETPLACES.

Forum II.  In partic., a public place, market-place.
b).  forum olitorium , the vegetable-market, south of the theatre of Marcellus, between the Tiber and the Capitoline hill; “here stood the columna lactaria, at which INFANTS were exposed,
In which professional cooks offered their services in preparing special entertainments, Plaut. Ps. 3, 2, 1.—
Olĭtōrĭus (or, better, hŏlĭtōrĭus ), a, um, adj. olitor,
I. of or belonging to a kitchengardener or to vegetables: “forum olitorium erat antiquum, macellum, ubi olerum copia,Varr. L. L. 5, § 146 Müll.; so, “forum,the green-market, Liv. 21, 62: “ostiola,Plin. 19, 8, 38, § 125: “rotae,id. 19, 5, 23, § 64 Sillig N. cr.: “horti,Dig. 50, 16, 198.

Liv. 21 62. In Rome or near it many prodigies occurred that winter, or —as often happens when men's thoughts are once turned upon religion —many were reported and too easily credited. Some of these portents were: that a free-born infant of six months had cried “Triumph!” [2] in the provision market; that in the cattle market an ox had climbed, [3??] of its own accord, to the third storey of a house and then, alarmed by the outcry of the occupants, had thrown itself down; [4] that phantom ships had been seen gleaming in the sky; that the temple of Hope, in the provision market, had been struck by lightning; that in Lanuvium a slain victim had stirred, and a raven had flown down into Juno's temple and alighted on her very couch; that in the district of Amiternum, in many places, apparitions of men in shining raiment had appeared in the distance, but had not drawn near to anyone;

and a supplication at the temple of Hercules, and later the entire people was commanded to observe this rite at all the pulvinaria;4 [10] also five major victims were slain in honour of the Genius of the Roman People; and Gaius Atilius Serranus the praetor was ordered to make a vow, “if the commonwealth should abide for ten years in its present state.” [11] The making of these vows and expiations, as prescribed by the Sibylline Books, went far to alleviate men's anxiety concerning their relations with the gods.
4 A lectisternium (for the first one in 399 B.C. see I. xiii. 6) was a banquet tendered to the gods, at which their images were placed on couches (pulvinaria). Juventas is here associated with Hercules, as was Hebe in Greece.

Pl. Ps. 3.2 BALLIO
Those who call it the cook's market, call it so foolishly; for 'tis not a cook's market, but a THIEVES' market. For if, upon oath, I were to seek out the worst of men, I couldn't have brought a worse one than this fellow that I'm bringing, one, chattering, bragging, silly, and worthless. Why, for this very reason Orcus has declined to take him to himself, that he might be here to cook a banquet for the dead; for here he is able to cook a thing to please them alone.

How now; are you an enchanter as well?

Why no, by my troth, I am rather a preserver7 of mankind.

But why don't you invite your enemies to it rather than your friends? For this day will I present to the guests a banquet so savoury, and I'll season it with such a dulcet sweetness, that whoever shall taste each thing that's seasoned, I'll make that same person to gnaw off the ends of his own fingers.

7. Rather a preserver: The "enchanters," who were called "venefici," "poisoners," were supposed to destroy men by their potions, whence the present reply of the Cook.

The PHARMAKEA performers in Revelation 18 identified the Babylon "scapegoat." Capella is the goat singer.

vĕnēnum , i, n., orig., like pharmakon,

The Seeker Center or "new style of music and drama" (The BEAST) imitates Apollo (Abaddon, Apollyon's) SEEKER CENTER at Delphi. The MUSES (locusts) were his "Musical Worship Team" and pretty low class. John calls them SORCERERS and consignes them to the LAKE OF FIRE.

Matt. 11:17 And saying, We have piped unto you, and ye have not danced; we have mourned unto you, and ye have not lamented.

[17] dicunt cecinimus vobis et non saltastis lamentavimus et non planxistis 

Cano  to utter melodious notes, to sing, sound, play

When children were DAMNED they were exposed in the marketplace: the Agora in Athens while the Ekklesia was up on the Hill.
The Psallo word MARKS those who dallied so they were fined and EXCLUDED from discussion.
Jay Guin:
  • A cappella music is a mark of the church.
  • A cappella is our identity. The Churches of Christ were founded as an exclusively a cappella fellowship, and to add instrumental services is to, therefore, be something else.
Absolutely false: A cappella music identifies the Castrated Opra singers the Pope imported into the Sistine chapel. They sang "organum" or in the style of the pipe organ. There was no congregational singing with instrumental accompaniment until long after the Reformation. In imitation of the Levites, all religious musicians had to be male but they had to perform the role of the female.  Previously, the Sistine and other cathedrals used FALSETTO singers wearing robes or "stola" as did David when he confessed to making himself VILE.
  • Jay Guin: Adding instrumental services will lead to division, because many churches will split rather than tolerate an instrumental service.
That's true: all instruments are imposed into the OWNERS property bought and supported to assemble as the Bible and recorded history authorizes.  Those who IMPOSE should, with minimal ethics, leave and join an instrumental church. Why do they "infiltrate and divert" your property and monies to their own hidden agenda? Why, it's cheaper than buying their own. Most sowing of discord in church history has been over the forms of music: singing as an ACT was not imposed until the year 373. Then as now the purpose--like the Scribes and Pharisees--was to violate the direct command about RESOURCE and sing their own propaganda
  • Many dearly loved members will feel compelled to leave to preserve relationships with family members elsewhere who won’t fellowship those who tolerate those who worship with an instrument.
  • But, we gonna split families so that we can violate the direct commands of God.
  • The instrument isn’t needed for the church’s mission. We can grow without it.
In favor of adding an instrumental service —
  • Instrumental music doesn’t damn (as demonstrated in the series on Patternism and the earlier post in this series “On God’s Salvation, Galatians, and the Instrument”).

    The serpent in the garden of Eden was a Musical Enchanter(ess). When Lucifer Christ called the singing and harp playing prostitute "wholly seduced" Eve it was this enchantment (the serpent mark) which brought sin into the world.

  • Instrumental music isn’t even sinful sinful (as demonstrated by several earlier posts in this series).

    Instrumental Music was idolatry at Mount Sinai: this vision of the nature of God as a "beast" was such an affront that God turned them over to worship the starry host (Exodus 32). Stephen was murdered because he informed the Jews that the temple was NOT commanded: the Monarchy came with becoming a Goyim or Gentile City state. Stephen tells us that the sins was instrumental music. (Acts 7)

  • Nowhere do the scriptures suggest that the church will be marked by the form of its worship. It is indeed marked by whom it worships and by its love (John 13:34-35) and unity (John 17:20-21). It’s marked by the indwelling Spirit (Ephesians 1:13). But not by a cappella music

    No where in Scripture does Christ define a worship service meaning hard bondage as in the sacrificial system. Christ the Rock ordained the Qahal, synagogue or Church of Christ in the wilderness: it wa sinclusive of Rest, Reading and Rehearsing the Word of God (only). It was exclusive of vocal or instrumental rejoicing.  The Jerusalem council defined the one-piece pattern for the synagogue which did not change.  Timothy and even the Gentiles were prepared for Christ because they attended synagogue:
  • Acts 15:21 For Moses of old time
            hath in every city
            them that preach him,
            being read in the synagogues every sabbath day.

    The ONLY Command of Jesus was for a one-piece pattern: reading and discussing His Word and the Lord's Supper which teaches about His death. His command was to make disciples by baptizing them and then teaching them what HE commanded to be taught.  Neither Jesus nor the Apostles added anything else to what Paul calls synagogue.
    John 12:44 Jesus cried and said, He that believeth on me, believeth not on me, but on him that sent me.
    John 12:45 And he that seeth me seeth him that sent me.
    John 12:46
    I am come a light into the world, that whosoever believeth on me should not abide in darkness.
  • John 12:47 And if any man hear my words, and believe not, I judge him not:
            for I came not to judge the world, but to save the world.

    John 12:48
    He that rejecteth me, and receiveth not my words, hath one that judgeth him:
    the word that I have spoken, the same shall judge him in the last day.

    Jesus refused to pray for the WORLD (the Pythagoras music as control concept) and said that the Father HIDES Himself from the wise: the wise or sophists are rhetoricians, singers, instrument players, actors and others Jesus called Hypocrites.
  • Our identity is in Christ. Indeed, when we speak of “us” as a subset of the Kingdom with its own traditions and heritage, we risk becoming sectarian, even factious, in our thinking. Is “us” the body of Christ, the church of Christ, the Kingdom of heaven? Or is “us” the portion of those who have an a cappella heritage? Why should we insist on an identity other than Christ? Why isn’t being in Christ enough?
    True: those who received the Words of Christ were baptized FOR the remission of sins. Only then did Christ add us to the Church which IS the kingdom and HE is still in charge as Head and Teacher. Those who "believeth not" are those who DENY the promise that "He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved." Only those have their spirits made holy and translated into a heavenly kingdom. The believeth nots or Apistos are defined as traitors and accusing Jesus of Lying. Jay Guin does not get the right to dominate other people's right of association.

  • Jay Guin:
    Refusing instrumental music leads to division. We are divided from brothers who worship with the instrument already — by our own decision to refuse fellowship. Why do we blame others for our own sinful attitude? Moreover, no one is suggesting that we deny our members the opportunity to worship a cappella. Therefore, if a member leaves because someone else in his congregation worships with an instrument, it’s not because he is being tempted to sin. It’s not because he is being asked to violate his conscience.

    Rather, he is acting on a false gospel that teaches that an entire congregation is damned if it allows any of its members to use an instrument — and that he leaves in violation of the truth of the gospel.

    False and judgmental: the church of Christ has existed under that name in all time periods: it always rejected the use of instruments. Jay doesn't know that NONE of the Bible is metrical: you cannot sing it tunefully if your life depends on it: you cannot be a disciple if you do not use one mind and one mouth to teach "that which iswritten for our learning." By definition a heretic or sectarian is one who ADDS something divisive into a peaceable church which is NOT required to carry out the mandate to "teach that which Christ commanded to be taught."  In fact, Paul commands us to come out or divorce ourselves from those who are pagans.

  • Jay Guin:
    It is a sad truth that many members will be more loyal to their earthly families than to their congregations — and so leave their congregation to avoid a fight with their families. But wouldn’t it be better if they, instead, took the opportunity to teach a better, truer gospel to their families?

    Such division is almost always the sowing of discord by the "senior pastor" who has no ordained roll and certainly no dole.  There is a contract: if we own a building and hire a preacher because the elders are not APT to teach then HE is disloyal and Biblically illiterate if hethinks that there is any role for instruments in what the Campbells called A School of Christ since they were Bible literate.

    If the use of machines which Christ in the prophets always denounced is true to the "gospel" then Jay Guin will be able to quote a verse.

  • Whether the instrument helps a church be more evangelistically effective depends on the local setting. But in most settings, I am convinced that the instrument will help. And how many souls should we be willing to sacrifice for the sake of internal peace — when internal strife over things like the instrument is sin? Why would we let the immaturity and false understandings of our members stand in the way of the Kingdom? Why not, instead, patiently, gently, and lovingly teach the truth of the gospel, over and over, until the members understand — and then change?

    The Evangel is the gospel truth: the use of music is NOT the gospel truth and no recorded history is ignorant of the fact that "evil people set their lies to melodies to cheat the ignorant."

    Epilegô, 2. . say besides, repeat, 4. . utter, pronounce a spell (cf.epeipon ), rhêsin mustikên. III 2. . in Hdt. also, con over, read, 3. . recount, in speaking
    kēl-eō , A. charm, bewitch, beguile, esp. by music, “korēn humnoisiE.Alc.359; “ōdaisPl.Ly.206b; “kēlōn phōnē hōsper OrpheusId.Prt.315a, cf.Luc.Ind.12; houtōs ekēlei, of Pericles as an orator, Eup.94.6; epadōn k. charm by incantation, Pl.Phdr.267d; me kēlēseis tropō; Achae.17.2; of bribery, Theopomp.Com.30:—Pass., “kēleitai aoidais
    epaoid-os , ho, A. = epōdos, LXXEx.7.11,22,al., Ph.1.449 (pl.), Arr. Epict.3.24.10, Man.5.183 (pl.). Adv. epaoid-ōs by way of a charm,

  • The scoffer Lucian pours out his sarcasm in a passage in which he speaks of the fraudulent prophet Alexander of Abonouteichos, who kept choir boys in the service of the gods with him:

    To all others he forbade pederasty (Platonic love of a man for a boy) as shameful. In order not to admit his own guilt in this matter, however, the admirable fellow devised the following scheme: he proposed to the cities in Paphlagonia and Pontus that every three years they should send him choir boys who would sing hymns of praise with him to the god. Moreover, only the noblest, fairest and most charming boys were to be sent -- after a previous careful examination. These he confined with himself, slept with and abused with every possible lechery. (Lucian, Alexander, 41.247}

    Choirs were used because "Thus they led the simple into error and
    sought to bewitch the ears of lay people, who are easily led astray by hymns and melodies."
    Plato Protagoras explains why Jesus cast out the musical minstrels like dung and consigned the pipers, singers and dancers to the marketplace along with the sellers of bodies and radishes:

    Alawys denounced: [347c] For it seems to me that arguing about poetry is comparable to the wine-parties of common market-folk. These people, owing to their inability to carry on a familiar conversation over their wine by means of their own voices and discussions--such is their lack of education--put a premium on flute-girls by hiring the extraneous voice of the flute at a high price, and carry on their intercourse by means of its utterance.

    Jesus consigned the pipers, singers and dancers to the marketplace.
    James A. Towle, Commentary on Plato: Protagoras
    : [NEAR WINE] this custom is followed in Xen. Symp. 2. 1 erchetai tis autois epi kômon (revel) Surakosios anthrôpos, echôn te aulêtrida agathên kai orchêstrida (dancing-girl) tôn ta thaumata dunamenôn poiein kai paida panu ge hôraion kai panu kalôs kitharizonta kai orchoumenon. These show their skill during the whole banquet. Plato, however, has the same view as the one here, when he says Symp. 176 e eisêgoumai tên men arti eiselthousan aulêtrida chairein ean, aulousan heautêi, ê an boulêtai tais gunaixi tais endon, hêmas de dia logôn allêlois suneinai to têmeron
    Alawys approved: But where the party consists of thorough gentlemen who have had a proper education, you will see neither flute-girls nor dancing-girls nor harp-girls, but only the company contenting themselves with their own conversation, and none of these fooleries and frolics--each speaking and listening decently in his turn.
Jay Guin: I would like to offer this simple proposal. I think each Church of Christ — regardless of faction — should do at least one of the following three things:
  • Begin a diligent program of teaching the grace of Christ. A proper course of study would include an understanding of the eternal purposes of God and his plan of redemption , Romans, the Gospels, Galatians, Hebrews, and Ephesians, all taught from a gospel perspective (which is also how they are written).

    Grace is power through teaching of Grace-Personified: Grace is never permissive. The appeal to Grace is a confession that one intends to do something nasty and things Grace will cover up the smell.
God gave Israel The Book of The Covenant of Grace at Mount Sinai. They refused to listen to the voice of God and demanded a mediator.  God outlawed the musical practices of the Levites from Egypt onward (Exodus 31). Without hearing this instruction they rose up to PLAY which was musical idolatry. God turned them over to worship the starry host and gave them a FIREY LAW to protect the weak from the Civil-Military-Priestly elite.  Christ in the prophets calls them robbers, parasites and hypocrites by naming slick speakers, singers and instrument players. Grace--which Jay Guin rejects--is OBEYING the type of the finished work of Jesus by being baptized: only after we have OBEYED are we then free from sin. Follow Jay and you will be LIBERATED while still in your sins. There is NOT grace for people who lie TO God and ABOUT God in all of the "instrument passages" so they can make you slaves of THEIR LAWS.
2Pet. 2:19 While they promise them liberty, they themselves are the servants of corruption:
        for of whom a man is overcome, of the same is he brought in bondage.

2 Peter 2:13 And shall receive the reward of unrighteousness,
          as they that count it pleasure to riot in the day time.
          Spots they are and blemishes, sporting themselves
          with their own deceivings [delusions] while they feast with you;

          All musicians and rhetoricians are equated to parasites.

Truph-ē ,softness, delicacy, daintiness, 2 Ep.Pet.2.13; II. [select] luxuriousness, wantonness,tōn gunaikōn t.Ar.Lys.387; t. kai akolasia, t. kai malthakia,

Malthak-ia , A. = malakia, Pl.R.590b.

Plat. Rep. 590b  and irascibility when they foster and intensify disproportionately the element of the lion and the snake1 in us?” “By all means.” “And do we not reprobate luxury and effeminacy for their loosening and relaxation of this same element when they engender cowardice in it?” “Surely.” “And flattery and illiberality when they reduce this same high-spirited element under the rule of the mob-like beast and habituate it for the sake of wealth and the unbridled lusts of the beast to endure all manner of contumely from youth up and become an ape2 instead of a lion?

Malak-ia , Ion. -, h(, (malakos)
A. softness, Hp.Aër.20: hence, of persons, moral weakness, opp. karteria, Arist.EN1150a31, cf. Hdt.6.11, Th.1.122, Lys.10.11, X.Smp.8.8, D.11.22, etc.; “ sautou zugomakhei m.Men.201.5.
2. = kinaideia, or Unnatural Lust
3. weakliness, sickness, LXX Ge.42.4, Ev.Matt.4.23, Ps.-Hdt.Vit.Hom.36, POxy.1151.27 (v A. D.); m. sōmatos, opp. psukhēs, Phld.Mus.p.30 K.
Aeschin. 1 131 For, Demosthenes, if anyone should strip off those exquisite, pretty mantle of yours, and the soft, pretty shirts that you wear while you are writing your speeches against your friends,1 and should pass them around among the jurors, I think, unless they were informed beforehand, they would be quite at a loss to say whether they had in their hands the clothing of a man or of a woman!

Entrupo (g1792) en-troo-fah'-o; from 1722 and 5171; to revel in: - sporting selves. 2. part. truphōn as Adj., effeminate, luxurious, Ar.Nu.48, etc.; “t. kai amelēsPl.Lg.901a; “to truphōneffeminacy, Ar.V.1455 (lyr.); also of things, dainty, delicate,basilikē kai truphōsa paideiaPl.Lg.695d;
hoi truphōntesspoiled pets, Id.Men.76b; en tais ekklēsiais t. kai kolakeuesthai,

gamêliôi lechei [marriage couch-bed] hêdonais, playing in the wind, exult over, treat haughtily or contemptuously, made a mock of, tinos sumphorais, III. use or abuse at pleasure

paideios or paideios (Hdn.Gr.1.135), on, A. = paidikos, of or for a boy, humnoi p. songs to the boys they loved, Pi.I.2.3, cf. Ath.13.601a;

Pind. I. 2 The men of old, Thrasybulus, who mounted the chariot of the Muses with their golden headbands, joining the glorious lyre, lightly shot forth their honey-voiced songs for young men, if one was handsome and had [5] the sweetest ripeness that brings to mind Aphrodite on her lovely throne. For in those days the Muse was not yet a lover of gain, nor did she work for hire. And sweet gentle-voiced odes did not go for sale, with silvered faces, from honey-voiced Terpsichore. But as things are now, she bids us heed [10] the saying of the Argive man, which comes closest to actual truth: “Money, money makes the man,” he said, when he lost his wealth and his friends at the same time.

Paison paizô [pais]
to play (on an instrument), Hhymn. II. to sport, play, jest, joke, Hdt., Xen., etc.; p. pros tina to make sport of one, mock him,

4. play on a musical instrument, h.Ap.206: c. acc., “Pan ho kalamophthogga paizōnAr.Ra.230; dance and sing, Pi. O.1.16.
5. play amorously, “pros allēlousX.Smp.9.2; “meta tinosLXX Ge.26.8; of mares, 
Hom. Od. 6.85 Nausicaa was leader in the song. And even as Artemis, the archer, roves over the mountains, along the ridges of lofty Taygetus or Erymanthus, joying in the pursuit of boars and swift deer, [105] and with her sport the wood-nymphs, the daughters of Zeus who bears the aegis, and Leto is glad at heart—high above them all Artemis holds her head and brows,
Matt. 11:8 But what went ye out for to see?
        A man clothed in SOFT raiment? behold, they that wear soft clothing are in kings’ houses.
Matt. 11:9 But what went ye out for to see? A prophet? yea, I say unto you, and more than a prophet.
Matt. 11:10 For this is he, of whom it is written,
        Behold, I send my messenger before thy face, which shall prepare thy way before thee.
Matt. 11:11 Verily I say unto you, Among them that are born of women t
        here hath not risen a greater than John the Baptist:
        notwithstanding he that is least in the kingdom of heaven is greater than he.
Matt. 11:12 And from the days of John the Baptist until now
        the kingdom of heaven suffereth violence, and the violent take it by force.
Matt. 11:13 For all the prophets and the law prophesied until John.
Matt. 11:14 And if ye will receive it, this is Elias, which was for to come.
Matt. 11:15 He that hath ears to hear, let him hear.
Matt. 11:16 But whereunto shall I liken this generation?
        It is like unto children sitting in the markets, and calling unto their fellows,
Matt. 11:17 And saying,
        We have piped unto you, and ye have not danced;
        we have mourned unto you, and ye have not lamented.
Psa. 75:0  To the chief Musician, Altaschith, A Psalm or Song of Asaph

This is a note added later to define how it might be performed. The Chief Musician is:

5329.  natsach, naw-tsakh´; a primitive root; properly, to glitter from afar, i.e. to be eminent (as a superintendent, especially of the Temple services and its music); also (as denominative from 5331), to be permanent:--excel, chief musician (singer), oversee(-r), set forward.

1368.  gibbowr, ghib-bore´; or (shortened)  gibbor, ghib-bore´; intensive from the same as 1397; powerful; by implication, warrior, tyrant:--champion, chief, x excel, giant, man, mighty (man, one), strong (man), valiant man.

1Chr. 15:19 So the singers, Heman, Asaph, and Ethan, were appointed to sound with cymbals of brass;

8085.  shama, shaw-mah´; a primitive root; to hear intelligently (often with implication of attention,obedience, etc.; causatively, to tell, etc.):—x attentively, call (gather) together

8086. shma , shem-ah´; (Aramaic) corresponding to 8085:--hear, obey.


6750.  = tsalal, tsaw-lal´; a primitive root (identical with 6749 through the idea of vibration); to tinkle, i.e. rattle together (as the ears in reddening with shame, or the teeth in chattering with fear):quiver, tingle.

6767.  tslatsal, tsel-aw-tsal´; from 6750 reduplicated; a clatter, i.e. (abstractly) whirring (of wings); (concretely) a cricket; also a harpoon (as rattling), a cymbal (as clanging):--cymbal, LOCUST, shadowing, spear.
Commentary Oedipus Tyrannus 708. Locasta The gods have prescience (498); but they impart it to no man, --not even to such ministers as the Delphian priests. Iocasta reveres the gods (647): it is to them, and first to Apollo, that she turns in trouble (911). But the shock which had befallen her own life, --when at the bidding of Delphi her first-born was sacrificed without saving her husband Laius--has left a deep and bitter conviction that no mortal, be he priest or seer, shares the divine foreknowledge.
(1) first, the god himself, speaking through a divinely frenzied being in whom the human reason was temporarily superseded (hence the popular derivation of mantikē from mania
6751.  tsalal, tsaw-lal´; a primitive root (identical with 6749 through the idea of hovering over (compare 6754)); to shade, as twilight or an opaque object:--begin to be dark, shadowing.


, ae, m., = tumpanotribês,
I. a taborer, a timbrel-player, a term of reproach for a soft, effeminate person (alluding to the priests of Cybele), Plaut. Truc. 2, 7, 49; cf. tympanum.

T. Maccius Plautus, Truculentus, or The Churl
STRATOPHANES (to PHRONESIUM.) What say you? Why have you dared to say that you love another man?
PHRONESIUM I chose to.
STRATOPHANES Say you so, indeed? I'll first make trial of that. Do you, for the sake of such a shabby present, vegetables, and comestibles, and vinegar-water, bestow your love upon an effeminate, frizzle-pated, dark-haunt frequenting, drum-drubbing debauchee, a fellow not worth a nutshell:

6 Is he deranged: "Hariolus." Literally, "a soothsayer," or "diviner." In their prophetic frenzy, these persons often had the appearance of being mad, and were so considered.
7 Drum-drubbing debauchee: "Typanotriba." Literally, "drum," or "tambourine beater." He alludes to the eunuch-priests of Cybele, who used to beat tambourines in her procession-probably in allusion to debauchees, emasculated by riot and dissipation

The Pope's Eunuchs [beginning of text] 

One of the vices which the Spaniards had brought to Italy in the 16 century along with the Borgia family and the Spanish Roman Emperors was the falsetto singer. There were artists who could sing falsetto with distinction, but as the opera gained in popularity in Italy the practice began of emasculating boys with good voices and retaining them as male soprani or,

as the Italians, with their usual lack of Christian reticence about sex called them, the castrati. They were in every opera in the 18th century, but foreign visitors were never reconciled to them. The famous English weekly,

The Spectator, wrote about "the shrill celestial whine of eunuchs," and by the end of the 18th century they began to fade out of the opera-house.

"The trained musicians which eventually appear around the time of David and Solomon mark a distinctive change in the history of Jewish music. Before this time much of the music was made by women." (Zondervan Pict., Music p. 313).

"Before the establishment of the kingdom under Saul, it was the women who, as in every young civilization, played a major part in the performance of music. Such figures as Miriam, Deborah, Jephtha's daughter, and the women hailing the young hero David have become almost archetypes of female musicians. Characteristic of all these cases is the familiar picture of a female chorus, dancing and singing, accompanied by frenzied drum-beating. This is the scene known to the entire Near East, and not even the severe rule of Islam could wholly suppress this age-old practice." (Int Dict of the Bible, Music, p. 457).

"Women and girls from the different ranks of society were proud to enter the service of the gods as singers and musicians. The understanding of this service was universal: these singers constituted the 'harem of the gods'." "The Catholic Johannes Quasten in Pagan and Christian Music tells it like it is)


Grace is radically redefined as are many other words.

Grace is another name for Jesus the Christ. Grace (charis) identified women like the Muses who were evil and sexual including "a male giving an erotic favor to another man. This is confessed by Carol Wimber as having a climactic like experience with the Spirit

Grace gives power not NOT divine permission to biolate the Will of God..
Titus 2:11 For the [1] grace of God that bringeth salvation hath appeared to all men John 1:14 And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.
Titus 2:12
[2] Teaching us that,
Acts 2:14 But Peter, standing up with the eleven, lifted up his voice, and said unto them, Ye men of Judaea, and all ye that dwell at Jerusalem, be this known unto you, and hearken to my words:
[3] denying ungodliness and worldly lusts, (music satifies the lust of the eyes and ears:Spurgeon)
Acts 2:36 Therefore let all the house of Israel know assuredly, that God hath made that same Jesus, whom ye have crucified, both Lord and Christ.
[4] we should live soberly, righteously, and godly, in this present world; Acts 2:37 Now when they heard this, they were pricked in their heart, and said unto Peter and to the rest of the apostles, Men and brethren, what shall we do?
Titus 2:14
[5] Who gave himself for us,
Acts 2:38 Then Peter said unto them Repent,
[6] that he might redeem us from all iniquity, [Lawlesness]
      Lutron redeem, Luo lavo , cleanse or wash
, bathe,
      lave. louôpurify, tina ek tôn hamartiôn  
Col. 1:14 In whom we have redemption through his blood,
and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ
for the remission of sins,  
Redemption or Remission happens ONLY after BAPTISM
even the forgiveness of sins:
        [7] and purify unto himself a peculiar people,
                zealous of good works.
and ye shall receive the gift of A holy spirit


G3084 lutroō loo-tro'-o From G3083 ; to ransom (literally or figuratively):—redeem.
G2511 katharizō kath-ar-id'-zo From G2513 ; to cleanse (literally or figuratively):—(make) clean (-se), purge, purify.
G3089 λύω luō loo'-o A primary verb; to “loosen” (literally or figuratively):—break (up), destroy, dissolve, (un-) loose, melt, put off. Compare G4486 .
  • For those churches that have already done this, make your teaching reality by either (or both) —
    • Actively and visibly fellowshipping instrumental congregations, demonstrating to your congregation and to the community that you truly consider instruments not to be a salvation or fellowship issue; and/or
    • Adding an instrumental service to your own worship.
Jay Guin: Think about it. If you aren’t willing to actively and visibly fellowship an instrumental congregation, then you have some serious teaching to do. Even if you’re persuaded that you don’t need the instrument to be effective in your mission, you must be united with the entire body of Christ. It’s a command. You don’t even have to infer it from silences.

Fellowshiping means that you ENDORSE, attend and support instrumental churches. That would entice people into sin. The fellowshiping ropa dopa knows that people can easily be seduced by music being called "spiritual."  This causes a hard-wired brain and based on all recorded history you can never repent. Using instruments in the face of a Holy God is without redemption: it violates direct commands for those still able to read BLACK text on BROWN paper.  It manifests a vision of A Holy (Wholly) Spirit God as a people who CAN be worshipped in house built by human hands and by the WORKS of human hands.

No, you do not have to be united with anyone but your local "school of the Word."  Jesus decided whom He will admit as a disciple. We are baptized in order to REQUEST that He give us A holy spirit or A good conscience so that He is able to communicate with us.

Jesus said that He would not pray for the World and those of the world will hate you and pour out psychological violence if you "speak where the Bible Speaks."

If in your setting you’d be more effective in Kingdom work with the instrument, I don’t see how you have a lot of choice. You can’t trade effectiveness in the work Jesus died for you to do for peace with legalists who misunderstand the gospel. For them, the proper response isn’t giving them control of the church. It’s instruction. For you, it’s being about your Father’s business.

Jay Guin: The Instrument as Proxy

I guess I’ve always known it, but until I was reviewing the interview with Rick Atchley and Chris Seidman, it didn’t really hit me that instrumental music is a proxy for nearly every division in the Churches of Christ. You see, the theology and hermeneutics we invented over the last 150 years to require a cappella singing and justify our division over the issue has led to a series of other divisions.

That's pretty ignorant.  It is a lie that WE invented a hermeneutic 150 years ago. The CENI is well developed by God who is the only one with instructional capacity since the imagination of mankind is only evil continually.  Here is a list of absolutes by Christ the Spirit in the Bible and ALL historic scholars and ALL founders of denominations.

These sowers of discord have worked their little heart out using the Bible to PROVE that God commanded instrumental music. So much for that.

It’s been often argued that if instrumental music is sin and if we must divide over instrumental music, then X is sin and we must divide over X, too. And thus the 20th Century is filled with one division after another over this X or another, all based on the doctrines invented to justify division over the instrument.

It is an absolute certainty that the Disciples invented this hermeneutic to INCLUDE that which is not commanded knowing that it will sow discord:
Richard L. Hamm:  I want to lift up these four basic sources of revelation.

Richard L. Hamm: The first is Scripture, which for Christians means, of course, the Holy Bible (which is to say the whole Bible: the Hebrew and Christian testaments).

The second is reason and the third is experience. We Disciples are quite appreciative of these sources. Our movement was born within the philosophical context of

John Locke who said that truth can be known through reason tempered with experience.
In this
secular age in which we live, I'm afraid that many of us have increasingly depended on these two sources alone, but reason and experience are two valuable sources for understanding God.

No, John Locke never said that. What he said was that Christianity was reasonable once it was revealed but the best of human reasoning could never discover or aid the discover of truth.

Richard L. Hamm: The fourth is tradition. The Church has learned some things in the past two thousand years (that's right, the Church learned some things even before Alexander Campbell!). By looking to the Church's tradition (its history, its declarations, its collective wisdom) one can learn much about the nature of God and the nature of humankind. As the sage has said, one who does not learn history is doomed to repeat it. Studying the church's tradition is a way for us to learn some things the easy way!

The Holy Spirit, the Spirit of the Living God,

uses these four sources of revelation to teach us who God is and who we are.

The Disciples also invented Their Law of Silence which lets THEM impose something they THINK God has been silent about and then YOU are bound to CONFORM to the new will of Jesus Christ. That is what Jay Guin is teaching.

Jay Guin: Therefore, if we finally persuade each other than we can’t bind the opinion of Third and Fourth Century bishops on one another, finally putting the whole instrumental music issue to rest, we’ve only cured one of many divisions. We’ll still argue over whether we must damn one another over elder re-affirmation or the role of women. The division will continue until we realize that the whole scheme that leads to this kind of thinking is anti-scriptural and wickedly divides the body of Christ.
(1 Corinthians 3:16-17 ESV) 16 Do you not know that you are God's temple and that God's Spirit dwells in you? 17 If anyone destroys God's temple, God will destroy him. For God's temple is holy, and you are that temple.

1 Cor. 3:16 Know ye not that ye are the temple of God, and
        that the Spirit of God dwelleth in you?

There was no singing as an ACT before Constantine in the 4th century.  Singins was imposed in a peaceable church in the year 373 and sowed massive discord.  He composed his own "bible" because he knew that NONE of the Bible was metrical and could not be sung even in that simple style.  No one did congregational singing with organ (only) accompaniment until  after the Reformation. 

That's what Jesus said in John 4 where worship is IN THE PLACE of the human spirit using THE SPIRIT of Truth or the Word of Christ.  Paul said to worship IN THE SPIRIT as opposed to IN THE FLESH as the only way to keep the DOGS out: these were the Cynics which proves that musical religion and homosexuality are always bound together.

The Levites are Rick Atchley, Jay Guin's etal PATTERNISM for music: if a Levite went NEAR any holy thing or IN the Holy or Most Holy Place they would be EXECUTED.  We are God's Temple and WE worship in OUR OWN SPIRIT and do not tolearte MEDIATORS just to get them killed literally or spiritually terminated.

We are the temple of God when God's SPIRIT dwells in us BY FAITH.

1 Cor. 3:17 If any man defile the temple of God,
        him shall God destroy; for the temple of God is holy,
        which temple ye are.

1 Co 6:16 What? know ye not that he which is joined to an harlot is one body?
        for two, saith he, shall be one flesh.

1 Co 6:17 But he that is joined unto the Lord is one spirit.

1 Cor. 3:18 Let no man deceive himself.
        If any man among you seemeth to be wise in this world,
        let him become a fool, that he may be wise.

-Exapataō , A. exapataskonAr.Pax1070 (hexam.):—Pass., fut. “-apatēthēsomaiPl.Grg.499c; but -apatēsomai in pass. sense, X. An.7.3.3:—deceive or beguile, deceive thoroughly,eitina pou . . eti elpetai exapatēseinIl.9.371, cf. Od.9.414, Pi.O.1.29, Hdt.1.153, Ar. V.901, etc.; “e. tina phrenasId.Pax1099 (hexam.); “e. kai phenakizeinD.21.204; seduce a woman, Hdt.2.114: c. dupl. acc., e. tina ti in a thing, X.Cyr.3.1.19; also “e. epi tois idiois sumbolaioisIsoc.10.7; peri sauton poieisthai . . eph' hois exapatas eleon surround yourself with compassion for your swindling tricks, D.21.196; e. tina hōs . . cheat him into believing that . ., X.An.5.7.6, cf. Pl.Cra.413d; e. noson beguile or assuage it, Luc.Nigr.7:—Pass., “hōs exapatētheisHdt.9.94; “enomizon exēpatēsthaiTh.5.42; “ēdei hupo tēs mētruias exapatōmenēAntipho1.19; “to deipnon exapatōmenosAr.V.60; “e. apatēnPlot.2.9.6:—Med. like Act., f.l. in Pl.Cra.439c.

In 2 Timothy 3 Paul showed how the SEXUAL self-seducing is carried out.

2 Tim 3: 12 Yea, and all that will live godly in Christ Jesus shall suffer persecution.

2 Tim 3: 13 But evil men and seducers shall wax worse and worse,
[wandering stars], and being deceived.


1114.  goes, go´-ace; goao (to wail); properly, a wizard (as muttering spells), i.e. (by implication) an imposter:  seducer.

goēs , ētos, ho,
A. sorcerer, wizard, Phoronis 2, Hdt.2.33,4.105, Pl.R. 380d, Phld.Ir.p.29 W.; “g. epōdos Ludias apo khthonosE.Ba.234, cf. Hipp.1038; prob. f.l. for boēsi Hdt.7.191.
2. juggler, cheat, “deinos g. kai pharmakeus kai sophistēsPl.Smp.203d; “deinon kai g. kai sophistēn . . onomazōnD.18.276; apistos g. ponērosId.19.109; “magos kai g.Aeschin.3.137: Comp. “goētoterosAch.Tat.6.7 (s. v. l.). (Cf. Lith. žavēti 'incantare'.)

epōd-os , on, (epadō
A. [select] singing to or over, using songs or charms to heal wounds, “epōdoi muthoiPl.Lg.903b.
b. [select] Subst., enchanter,e. kai goēsE.Hipp. 1038 (but “goēs e.Ba.234): c. gen., a charm foragainst,ethusen hautou paida epōdon Thrēkiōn aēmatōnA.Ag.1418 ; e. tōn toioutōn one to charm away such fears, Pl.Phd.78a. or
c. [select] c. dat., assisting, profitable,e. gignesthai neois pros aretēnId.Lg.671a ; “duspraxia lēphtheis e. esti peirōmenōTrag.Adesp.364.4.
2. [select] epōdos, ho, verse or passage returning at intervals, in Alcaics and Sapphics, D.H.Comp.19 ; chorus, BURDEN, refrain, Ph. 1.312 : metaph., ho koinos hapasēs adoleskhias e.Plu.2.507e.
the 'old story',


Sophos , ē, on, A. skilled in any handicraft or art, clever, harmatēlatas s. Pi.P.5.115, cf. N.7.17; “kubernētēsA.Supp.770; mantis Id.Th.382; “oiōnothetasS.OT484 (lyr.); of a sculptor, E.Fr.372; even of hedgers and ditchers, Margites Fr.2; but in this sense mostly of poets and musicians, Pi.O.1.9, P.1.42, 3.113; en kithara s. E.IT1238 (lyr.), cf. Ar.Ra.896 (lyr.), etc.; tēn tekhnēn -ōteros ib.766; “peri tiPl.Lg.696c; glōssē s. S.Fr.88.10; “sophos ho polla eidōs phua, mathontes de labroiPi.O.2.86.
also en oiōnois, kithara, E. IT662, 1238 (lyr.

SOPHIA Using the NOMOS or laws of Music includes or demands BOY LOVE: this is opposite to LOGOS or the Word.

Tekhn-ē , h(, (tektōn) A. art, skill, cunning of hand, of a soothsayer, A.Ag.249,
tekhnai heterōn heteraiPi.N.1.25;  (Religious whores) epi tekhnē mathein ti to learn a thing\n#lexiconally
the Art of Rhetoric, Pl.Phd.90b; hoi tas t. tōn logōn suntithentes systems of rhetoric,
also en oiōnois, kithara, E. IT662, 1238 (lyr.);

1 Cor. 3:19 For the wisdom of this world (kosmou) is foolishness with God:
        For it is written, He taketh the WISE in their own craftiness.


Craftiness is: panourg-ia ,A.knavery, A. Th.603, S.Ph.927, Lys.22.16, Pl.Lg.747c, Arist.EN1144a27: in pl., villainies, S.Ant.300, Ar.Eq.684, etc.


1 Cor. 3:20 And again, The Lord knoweth the thoughts of the wise, that they are vain.

The Thoughts of the wise are doubtful disputations or thoughts: all of the food/musical sects are silenced in romans 14 so that the Word of God can be taught and learned in Romans 15 where SELF-pleasure marks those who use the performing arts to bring on reproaches heaped on Christ which means to EXPOSE HIS NAKEDNESS.


II. alculation, consideration, Pl.Ax.367a; “d. labein peri sphōn autōnStr. 5.3.7; ho d. houtos this consideration,Phld.D.1.15.
III. debate, argument, discussion,

1 Cor. 3:21 Therefore let no man glory in men. For all things are yours;

Jay Guin: “You” is plural in each occurrence in this passage. “You” is the church, and “destroys” refers to dividing God’s church.

The only way I can figure that we can atone for dividing God’s church is to re-unite it. It’s not enough to say we’re sorry. It’s not enough to teach a better gospel.

        These are necessary steps, but we must swallow hard, eat a little crow, and shake the hands of those we separated from.

The Church of Christ was NEVER part of the Disciples / Christian churches. The Church of Chrisit simply said they could NOT be counted as claimed members of the "organ and society party" in 1906. The Christian Church sected out of the Disciples from 1927 to 1971. 

See J.F. Burnett in 1921 denying that the Church of Christ joined the Disciples which had NOT ONE belief in common with The Church of Christ.

The Stone Campbell Movement (sect) WAS AND IS BASED ON ABSOLUTE FALSEHOOD.

The Way of Unity H. Leo. Boles at an early "unity" meeting intended to steal sheep.

Boles said that there was some "unity" from 1832 until 1849

The Stone Campbell Movemant began as soon as The Christian Church finally sected out of the Disciples in 1971: UNITY has always been a very SLY way of forcing congregations who had NEVER used instruments to BEGIN.

Jay Guin: We must actually unite and be in fellowship with the entirety of the body of Christ. Anything short of that is to be an accessory-after-the-fact, permitting the continuance of destructive divisions that we may not have caused but which we inherited and that we are charged to heal. We are called to be peacemakers, not keepers of the status quo.

And if we’ll put the instrumental music controversy behind us by taking an affirmation step
        to reach out to the instrumental community of Christians,
        we’ll not only take a step toward unity as to the instrument,
        we’ll help put to death the entire body of doctrine
        that seeks to divide and damn over countless petty disagreements.

God called us to do good works, and I can think of none greater than working for the unity of his people.

While Alexander Campbell admitted that there were 'C'hristians among the SECTS: He said that they should come out of Babylon.

The Babylon Mother of Harlots in Revelation 17
Will use the lusted after FRUITS Amos warned about.
They will be Rhetoricians, Singers and instrumen players.
John called them SORCERERS.

Let Jay Guin repent:
  • 1926: The first North American Christian Convention (NACC) in 1927 was the result of disillusionment at the DoC Memphis Convention.
  • 1930s - 1940s: Symbolic differences and disagreements flourished.
  • 1955: The Directory of the Ministry was first published listing only the "Independents" on a voluntary basis.
  • 1968: Final redaction of the Disciples Year Book removing Independent churches
  • 1971: Independent churches listed separately in the Yearbook of American Churches.
It is the worst falsehood to say that the Churches of Christ divided from the Christian churches in 1906.
If Jay Guin wants to UNITE then he is duty bound to try to unite with the Disciples of Christ to which the Church of Christ never belonged.

The Future of the Progressive Churches of Christ

Jay Guin: In the interview, Rick and Chris made a powerful point regarding the future of the progressive Churches of Christ, which is that these churches are plateaued and soon to die if they don’t change.

They both twisted and falsified every Biblical and historical notice of an instrument.

Up until now, most progressive Churches of Christ have operated as hospitals for broken Church of Christ members but not as beachheads of the Kingdom in the world. My own congregation has many members who grew up in legalistic a cappella Churches of Christ, and we’ve experienced dramatic growth because of they transferred from less grace-centered churches. But we’re plateaued. Why? Well, in part because you can’t grow but so much through transfers, and in part because we aren’t very evangelistically effective.

Most people die in hospitals says my old Dad. Many deadly diseases are spread in hospitals. Most of the division for the last three decades have been by dupes of the NACC spreading their false teaching.

Christ in Isaiah 30 says that hell was prepared for the enemies of God: the MARKS in sight and sound of God beginning to carry out the final execution will be the wind, string and percussion instruments that Lucifer--the singing and harp playing prostitute--brought with him/her/it into the Garden of Eden.
2Tim. 3:6 For of this sort are they which creep into houses,
        and lead captive silly women laden with sins, led away with divers lusts,
2Tim. 3:7 Ever learning, and never able to come to the knowledge of the truth.
2Tim. 3:8 Now as Jannes and Jambres withstood Moses,
        so do these also resist the truth:
        men of corrupt minds, reprobate concerning the faith.
2Tim. 3:9 But they shall proceed no further:
        for their folly shall be manifest unto all men, as theirs also was.

2Tim. 3:10 But thou hast fully known my doctrine, manner of life, purpose, faith, longsuffering, charity, patience,
2Tim. 3:11 Persecutions, afflictions, which came unto me at Antioch,
        at Iconium, at Lystra; what persecutions I endured: but out of them all the Lord delivered me.
2Tim. 3:12 Yea, and all that will live godly in Christ Jesus shall suffer persecution.
2Tim. 3:13 But evil men and seducers shall wax worse and worse, deceiving, and being deceived.

G1114 goēs go'-ace From γοάω goaō (to wail); properly a wizard (as muttering spells), that is, (by implication) an impostor:—seducer.

Goês , êtos, ho, Used with:

2. Juggler, cheat, deinos g. kai pharmakeus kai sophistês Pl.Smp.203d ; deinonkai g. kaisophistên . . onomazôn D.18.276 ; apistos g. ponêrosId.19.109 ; magoskai g. Aeschin.3.137 : Comp. goêtoteros Ach.Tat.6.7 (s. v. l.). (Cf. Lith. žavēti 'incantare'.)
pharmakos (on the accent v. Hdn.Gr.1.150), ho, , A. poisoner, sorcerer, magician,LXXEx.7.11 (masc.), Ma.3.5 (fem.), Apoc.21.8, 22.15.
Epôidos [epaidô] I.singing to or over: as Subst. an enchanter, Eur.: c. gen. acting as a charm for or against, Aesch., Plat. 2. pass. sung or said after, morphês epôidonc alled after this form, 
II. in metre, epôidos, ho, a verse or passage returning at intervals, a chorus, BURDEN refrain, as in Theocr.
2Tim. 3:14 But continue thou in the things which thou hast learned
        and hast been assured of, knowing of whom thou hast learned them;
2Tim. 3:15 And that from a child thou hast known the holy scriptures,
        which are able to make thee wise unto salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus.
2Tim. 3:16 All scripture is given by inspiration of God,
        and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:
2Tim. 3:17 That the man of God may be perfect, throughly furnished unto all good works.
The Progressives have a pit of fire prepared for them their harps and still-breathing harpists.

John called the slick speakers, singers and instrument players, SORCERERS in Revelation 18:23

Rev 20:[10] The devil who deceived them was thrown into the lake of fire and sulfur,
        where the beast and the false prophet are also.
        They will be tormented day and night forever and ever.

10 kai ho diabolos ho planōn autous eblēthē eis tēn limnēn toupuros kai theiou,” hopou kai to thērion kai hopseudoprophētēs, kai basanisthēsontai hēmeras kai nuktos eis tous aiōnas tōn aiōnōn.

If Jesus died to establish the WAY then to progress beyond what is written defines the Wandering Stars: God's abandonment to the Worship of the Starry Host because of musical idolatry.
Plan-aō 3. lead astray, mislead, deceive 2. wander in speaking, “p. en logōHdt.2.115; digress, “p. apo tou logouPl.Plt.263a. 5. to be in doubt or at a loss

Planos [a^, on,
1. Act., leading astray, deceiving, p. kateseion edōdan the bait, Theoc.21.43, cf. AP7.702 (Apollonid.); p. dōra, agra, Mosch.1.29, Fr.1.10; “pneumata1 Ep.Ti.4.1.
2. Pass., wandering, roaming, fickle, “poikilon pragm' esti kai planon tukhēMen.Kith.Fr.8 ; p. pheggē planets, Man.4.3.
Poikilos i^, ē, on, III. metaph., changeful, diversified, manifold, 2. of Art, p. humnos a song of changeful strain or full of diverse art, Pi.O.6.87; “poikilon kitharizōnId.N.4.14; “dedaidalmenoi pseudesi poikilois muthoiId.O.1.29; of style, “lexis poiētikōtera kai p.Isoc.15.47 (Comp.); “skhēmatismoiD.H.Is.3

The Beasts are
thērion mousikē aei ti kainon thērion tikteiA New Style of Song and Drama. Plato said that when people change the style of music you KNOW that they intend to also change the laws.
Rev. 21:8 But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers,
        and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake
        which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death.
Rev. 22:15 For without are dogs, and sorcerers, and whoremongers, and murderers,
        and idolaters, and whosoever loveth and maketh a lie.
This fulfils the PATTERNISM of the King of Babylon as Lucifer (Zoe)
Is. 14:10 All they shall speak and say unto thee, Art thou also become weak as we? art thou become like unto us?
Is. 14:11 Thy pomp is brought down to the grave, and the noise of thy viols:
        the worm is spread under thee, and the maggots cover thee.
Is. 14:12 How art thou fallen from heaven, O Lucifer,
        son of the morning! how art thou cut down to the ground,
        which didst weaken the nations!
Is. 14:13 For thou hast said in thine heart, I will ascend into heaven,
        I will exalt my throne above the stars of God:
        I will sit also upon the mount of the congregation, in the sides of the north:
Is. 14:14 I will ascend above the heights of the clouds; I will be like the most High.
Is. 14:15 Yet thou shalt be brought down to hell, to the sides of the pit.

Ezek. 28:8 They shall bring thee down to the pit, and thou shalt die the deaths of them that are slain in the midst of the seas.
Ezek. 28:13 Thou hast been in Eden the garden of God;
        every precious stone was thy covering, the sardius, topaz, and the diamond, the beryl,
        the onyx, and the jasper, the sapphire, the emerald, and the carbuncle, and gold:
        the workmanship of thy tabrets and of thy pipes was prepared in thee
        in the day that thou wast created. (cast down)
Ezek. 28:14 Thou art the anointed cherub that covereth; and I have set thee so:
        thou wast upon the holy mountain of God; thou hast walked up and down in the midst of the stones of fire.
Ezek. 28:15 Thou wast perfect in thy ways from the day that thou wast created, till iniquity was found in thee.
Ezek. 28:16 By the multitude of thy merchandise they have filled the midst of thee with violence,
        and thou hast sinned: therefore I will cast thee as profane out of the mountain of God:
        and I will destroy thee, O covering cherub, from the midst of the stones of fire.
It ia a fact that for more than a decade Rick Atchley has used all of those devices called witchcraft or sorcery and sowing more discord than any person in recorded history counting the numbers. To the credit of Churces of Christ less than a dozen out of 28,000 have agreed to drink his KoolAid.  Maybe Churches of Christ LOVE to be law abiding and not LAW of minimal ethics breaking.

Legalistic is one of those RACA words to be used against anyone who will not sing and dance when the piper's pipe. NOT using instruments because the are OUTLAWED and the MARK and CAUSE of many Biblical falls from grace to be DAMNED in the Lake of Fire..


Hey, Jay Guin thinks that being progressive (back to Babylon) is more powerful than teaching the gospel including all that Christ taught. Making yourself a PARTNER or SUPERIOR to God is dangerous. That is especially true because LEGALISM is defined ONLY in promoting the laws of Apollo (Abaddon, Apollyon) using the Muses known as dirty adulteresses.

Plato Georgias[483c]
[483c] and to terrorize the stronger sort of folk who are able to get an advantage, and to prevent them from getting one over them, they tell them, that such aggrandizement is foul and unjust, and that wrongdoing is just this endeavor to get the advantage of one's neighbors: for I expect they are well content to see themselves on an equality, when they are so inferior. So this is why by convention it is termed unjust and foul to aim at an advantage over the majority,
  and why they call it wrongdoing: but nature, in my opinion
  herself proclaims the fact that it is right for the better to have advantage of the worse,
  and the abler of the feebler.
           It is obvious in many cases that this is so, not only in the animal world,
           but in the states and races, collectively, of men-
          -that right has been decided to consist in the sway and advantage of the stronger over the weaker.
           For by what manner of right did Xerxes

Plato Gorgias [483e] march against Greece, or his father against Scythia? Or take the countless other cases of the sort that one might mention. Why, surely these men follow nature--the nature of right--in acting thus; yes, on my soul, and follow the law1 of nature--though not that, I dare say, which is made by us;
          we mold the best and strongest amongst us,
          taking them from their infancy like young lions,
          and utterly enthral them by our spells
Callicles boldly applies the word nomos, which so far has been used in the sense of man-made law or convention, in its widest sense of “general rule” or “principle.”
Nomos: II. melody, strain, oida d' ornichôn nomôs pantôn Alcm.67 ; n. hippios Pi.O. 1.101 ; Apollôn hageito pantoiôn n. Id.N.5.25; n. polemikoi Th.5.69 ; epêlalaxan Arai ton oxun n. A.Th.952 (lyr.); krektoi n. S.Fr. 463 , cf. AP9.584: metaph., tous Haidou

Pindar, Odes 5. The most beautiful chorus of Muses sang gladly for the Aeacids on Mt. Pelion, and among them Apollo, sweeping the seven-tongued lyre with a golden plectrum, [25][25] led all types of strains. And the Muses began with a prelude to Zeus, then sang first of divine Thetis and of Peleus; how Hippolyte, the opulent daughter of Cretheus, wanted to trap him with deceit

2. esp. a type of early melody created by Terpander for the lyre as an accompaniment to Epic texts, n. orthios Hdt.1.24 ; n. Boiôtios S.Fr.966 ; n. kitharôidikoi Ar.Ra.1282 , cf. Pl.Lg.700d, Arist.Po.1447b26, Pr.918b13, etc.; also for the flute, n. aulôidikos Plu.2.1132d ; without sung text, n. aulêtikos ib.1133d, cf. 138b, Poll.4.79; later, composition including both words and melody

[40] The fortune that is born along with a man decides in every deed. And you, Euthymenes from Aegina, have twice fallen into the arms of Victory and attained embroidered hymns.

Psauô  humnosMousa 1 [*maô] 

I. the Muse, in pl. the Muses, goddesses of song, music, poetry, dancing, the drama, and all fine arts, Hom.: the names of the nine were Clio, Euterpe, Thalia, Melpomene, Terpsichore, Erato, Polymnia or Polyhymnia, Urania, and Calliope, Hes.,

LEGALISM is forcible compulsory treatment using music.

ek neôn lambanontes: cf. Apol. 18 b ek paidôn paralabontes. The usual word for ‘receiving into school’ is the compound. Cf. 516 b. The use of the simple verb here implies a forcible compulsory manner of treatment. [516b] of any animal whatever a bad one, if he turns out the creature he received tame so much wilder than he found it? Do you, or do you not?

hôsper leontas katepaidontes: the comparison describes with bitterness the suppression of the so-called natural freedom, in that it compares education to the taming of wild beasts (katadouloumetha). katepaideinsoothing by certain formulae, or charms; goêteuein to the employment of forms of magic and witchcraft. Meno uses the same expression regarding the dialectic proof of Socrates, 80 a kai nun, hôs g' emoidokeis, goêteueis me kai pharmatteis kai atechnôs katepaideis. In a jesting way, without feeling, epaidein is used in Phaedo 77 e, epôidê in Charm. 155 e. applies to

A. katadoul-  reduce to slavery, enslaveI. metaph., enslave in mind, break in spirit, cf. 2 Ep.Cor.11.20;

2Cor. 11:18 Seeing that many glory after the flesh, I will glory also.
2Cor. 11:19 For ye suffer fools gladly, seeing ye yourselves are wise.
2Cor. 11:20 For ye suffer, if a man bring you into bondage, if a man devour you, 
        if a man take of you, if a man exalt himself, if a man smite you on the face.

B. katep-aidô , Same as epôidêcantiohymnizo

    A. subdue by song or enchantment, tinaPl.Grg.483e, Men.80a, Plu.Dio14, Lib.Or.64.91; tastônneôn psuchas Max.Tyr.23.3 ; overcome by a spell, Phld.Lib.p.290.; soothe, tinos Ach.Tat.7.10.  2. sing by way of enchantment, Id.2.7.  II. to be always repeating, Ph.2.304, Anon. ap. Suid., Hld.7.10, Ach.Tat.2.19.
Plato, Meno [80a] that yours was just a case of being in doubt yourself and making others doubt also: and so now I find you are merely bewitching me with your spells and incantations, which have reduced me to utter perplexity. And if I am indeed to have my jest, 
        I consider that both in your appearance and in other respects 
        you are extremely like the flat torpedo sea-fish;
        for it benumbs anyone who approaches and touches it,
        and something of the sort is what I find you have done to me now. For in truth
C. Goêt-euô ,

A.bewitch, beguile, Pl.Grg.483e, etc.:--Pass., Id.R.412e, 413b, D.19.102, etc.; fascinate, as a snake, Plot.4.4.40. 
abs., play the wizard, D.L.8.59.

D. Pharmassô2.enchant or bewitch by potions or philtres, bewitch by flattery ,Pl.Smp.194a, Men.80a:--

Pharmak-eus , eôs, ho, poisoner, sorcerer, S.Tr.1140, Pl.Smp.203d, etc.; gnêsioi sophistai kai ph. Jul.Or.6.197d

Sophistês 1 [sophizomai]

I. a master of one's craft or art, an adept, of a diviner, Hdt.; of poets, Pind.; of the Creator, Plat.; metaph., s. pêmatôn an adept in misery, Eur.
2. a sophist (in bad sense), a
quibbler, cheat,  

Sophia , A. cleverness or skill in handicraft and art, as in carpentry, in music and singing, technêikai s. h.Merc.483, cf. 511; in poetry, Sol.13.52, Pi.O.1.117, Ar.Ra.882, X.An.1.2.8, etc.;

Pharmakos (on the accent v. Hdn.Gr.1.150), ho, hê, poisoner, sorcerer, magician, LXXEx.7.11 (masc.), Ma.3.5 (fem.), Apoc.21.8, 22.15.

Commonly used with:

Anaireô, anêirêka (aneir-dub. in Com.Adesp.18.6D.): (v. haireô): --take up, anelontes apo chthonos having raised the victim from the ground, so as to cut its throat (cf. aueruô), take up and carry off, bear away, esp. prizes. of oracle's answer to inquiry

E.  Epaeidô , contr. Att. epaidô , fut.

F.  Epôidê , Ion. and poet. epa^oidê , ,

      II. apptly., = epôidos11, Poet.Oxy.661.21 (pl.).
Jay Guin: Meanwhile, in my home town, community churches that teach a non-denominational Christianity that places scripture above tradition and that study the Bible rather than their denominational history are growing. They stole our playbook!

An ekklesia of Christ will be despised and rejected of men: if you are growing you probably are NOT BIBLE BASED.

There is unquestionably a need for a church that nurses and heals those broken by the legalist congregations of our denomination. But that need is quickly ending as the old legalistic congregations are dying. Members my age tell me of their old churches back home being down to 20 members, demanding one more sermon on baptism and the Five Acts. We won’t be receiving any more wounded from those churches.


Besides, that's just a flat lie: most churches tend to shrink as population explodes. Facts are that CONSERVATIVE churches are growing and the progressive churches as liberal self destruct because the mark of music is a neutered leadership.

See the "new style of music" (the beast) is derived from the snake handlers and voodoo: always led by the female or effeminate.


Ea held the "rules of the game" or supernatural powers called the ME. Inanna (call her Ishtar, Zoe, etc) got him drunk and stole the powers. Among these she became:

The holy priestess of heaven!
..........The setting up of lamentations!
..........The rejoicing of the heart!

He gave me the princess priestess.
He gave me the divine
queen priestess.
He gave me the
incantation priest.

He gave me truth.
He gave me
decent into the underworld.
He gave me
ascent from the underworls.
He gave me the
.......... The kurgarru, the assinu, and the kulu'u performed plays,
.......... music, dances, and games during rituals

He gave me the loosening of hair.
He gave me the
binding of hair.
He gave me the
He gave me the
He gave me the art of
.......... He gave me the art of kissing the phallus.
.......... He gave me the art of prostitution.

He gave me the holy shrine.
He gave me the
holy priestess of heaven.
.......... He gave me the resounding musical instrument.
.......... He gave me the art of song.
.......... He gave me the art of the elder.

Now, Flash-Forward To Your End-Time Blend of Religion and Sex

First, the PATTERNISM for instrumental music is lifted from animal sacrifices specificially the BURNT OFFERING. However, Christ in Isaiah 1, Jeremiah 7 etal deny that God commanded musical instruments. In fact, he OUTLAWED them in Exodus 31 and the Israelites refused to hear God's instructions and in Exodus 32 fell into MUSICAL IDOLATRY. God abandoned them to worship the starry host and that is what they did.

"In all of these early cultures the social functions of music were essentially the same since their climate, geographic location, cultural pace, and mutual influences produced many more social similarities than differences.

The primary function of music was apparently religious, ranging from heightening the effect of "magic" to ennobling liturgies.

The other musical occasions depicted in both pictures and written accounts were equally functional:
    stirring incitements to military zeal,
    soothing accompaniments to communal or solitary labour,
    heightening aids to dramatic spectacles, and
    enlivening backgrounds to social gatherings that involved either singing or dancing or both.
    In every case musical sounds were an adjunct
    either to
bodily movement (dance, march, game, or work) or to song.
Many centuries were to pass before pleasure in euphonious sound became an end in itself. Ancient Greece (Britannica Members)
John Calvin and all disciples understood this fact:

John Calvin also understood "Dispensational Distinctions" as well as the place of music in the Law period under the monarchy of kings rather than of God.

"There is then no other argument needed to condemn superstitions, than that they are not commanded by God: for when men allow themselves to worship God according to their own fancies, and attend not to His commands, they pervert true religion." Calvin's Commentaries, 9:414.

He continues:

"Hebrews 9:1. "Then verily the first", &c. After having spoken generally of the abrogation of the old covenant, he now refers specially to the ceremonies.

His object is to show that

there was nothing practiced then to which Christ's coming has not put an end.

He says first, that under the old covenant there was a specific form of divine worship, and that it was peculiarly adapted to that time. It will hereafter appear by the comparison what kind of things were those rituals prescribed under the Law.

"Were any one to ask why the Apostle speaks with so little respect and even with contempt of Sacraments divinely instituted, and extenuates their efficacy?

This he does, because he separates them from Christ; and we know that when viewed in themselves they are but beggarly elements, as Paul calls them. (Gal. 4: 9.)

Jay Guin: While we still need to help wounded Christians recover from legalism,
        the greater need is to help heal a wounded world.
        And we are working to becoming that kind of church. But, yet, one thing remains.
        We have to become united with the rest of God’s Kingdom.
        We can’t plausibly claim to be a part of the body of Christ
        while isolated from our instrumental brothers in other congregations.

And our members have to decide that we have to give a few comforts up to be more effective in the mission of God.

Recent studies show that evangelical churches aren’t growing much at all as a whole, but that non-denominational community churches are growing rapidly. That means the denominational churches are losing members to non-denominational churches. And isn’t that what the Restoration Movement has always been about? Calling believers out of the denominations to be united on just the gospel?

Of course, it would be woefully inadequate to merely steal sheep from the denominations in order to grow a congregation but not the Kingdom! No, the goal is the expansion of the Kingdom, and that can only be accomplished by uniting the Kingdom — which is quite impossible if we insist on being separate.

As Thomas Campbell wrote in 1809 —
"Meantime the truly religious of all parties are grieved, the weak stumbled; the graceless and profane hardened, the mouths of infidels opened to blaspheme religion; and thus, the only thing under heaven, divinely efficacious to promote and secure the present spiritual and eternal good of man, even the gospel of the blessed Jesus, is reduced to contempt; while multitudes deprived of a gospel ministry, as has been observed, fall an easy prey to seducers, and so become the dupes of almost unheard of delusions. Are not such the visible effects of our sad divisions, even in this otherwise happy country. — Say, dear brethren, are not these things so.

Should we not, then, be excited by these considerations to concur with all our might, to help forward this good work; that what yet remains to be done, may be fully accomplished. And what though the well-meant endeavors after union have not, in some instances, entirely succeeded to the wish of all parties, should this dissuade us from the attempt!

Indeed, should Christians cease to contend earnestly for the sacred articles of faith and duty once delivered to the saints, on account of the opposition and scanty success which, in many instances, attend their faithful and honest endeavors; the Divine cause of truth and righteousness might have long ago been relinquished.

And is there anything more formidable in the Goliah schism, than in many other evils which Christians have to combat? Or, has the Captain of Salvation sounded a desist from pursuing, or proclaimed a truce with this deadly enemy that is sheathing its sword in the very bowels of his Church,

rending and mangling his mystical body into pieces? Has he said to his servants, Let it alone? If not, where is the warrant for a cessation of endeavors to have [8] it removed?

Jesus command was that we "Teach that which I HAVE COMMANDED to be Taught." to be an article of faith and duty Jay must assume that Jesus commanded us to have fellowship with the world (for which He refused to pray) by imposing INSTRUMENTAL MUSIC instead of teaching what He commanded to be taught.  IN FACT Jesus demands that we SEPARATE from the Scribes and Pharisees whom He named as hypocrites including speakers, singers and instrument players. A rhetorician is IN FACT the meaning of a hypocrite and a singer or enchanter is includeed.

Jay Guin: The goal of the Restoration Movement was to heal divisions. Thomas Campbell and Barton W. Stone had founded the Movement and seen it grow and prosper long before anyone even thought about an instrumental music controversy. The goal was unity, and we can’t claim to be promoting unity while insisting on remaining a sect separate from other believers, divided by our anti-gospel refusal to fellowship those who use the instrument.

None of the groups which flowed into the Restoration movement had EVER used instruments and called it worship. Therefore, those who INTRODUCED instruments--always to fill the coffers--were THE sowers of discord, heretics and sectarians. The Church of Christ was never part of any instrument group.

Barton W. Stone had absolutely nothing in common with Campbell including baptism and Stone denied the atonement: he said that a man could be good enough to save himself. To that end the Stoneites included the Shouting Methodists which, with instruments came through the Catholic, Anglican, Methodists.  Stone fathered the Disciples/Christian churches NOT the Campbell movement which came full force when Thomas Campbell got off the boat fueled by John Calvin's call for "The Restoration of the Church of Christ.
1. Let me ask, in the first place, what could mean all that we have written upon the union of Christians on apostolic grounds, had we taught that all Christians in the world were already united in our own community?

2. And in the second place, why should we so often have quoted and applied to apostate Christendom what the Spirit saith to saints in Babylon--"Come out of her, my people, that you partake not of her sins, and that you receive not of her plagues"--had we imagined that the Lord had no people beyond the pale of our communion!

3. But let him that yet doubts, read the following passages from the Christian Baptist, April, 1825:--

"I have no idea of seeing, nor wish to see, the sects unite in one grand army.
This would be dangerous to our liberties and laws. For this the Saviour did not pray.
It is ONLY the disciples DISPERSED among them that reason and benevolence would call out of them, "&c. &c. This looks very like our present opinion of Christians among the sects!!! 2d ed. Bethany, p. 85.

4. Again, speaking of purity of speech in order to the union of Christians, we say,
None of you [Christians] have ever yet attempted to show how Christians can be united on your principles.

You have often showed how they may be divided, and how each party may hold its own,
        but while you pray for the visible unity of the disciples,
        and advocate their visible disunity,
        we cannot understand you." March, 1827, vol. 4.

The Churches of Christ called for baptized believers IF they were among the sects to COME OUT OF BABYLON.
Jay Guin: Finally, our children care nothing about the instrumental music controversy. They’ve not heard the sermons, and they’ve not engaged in the debates. To them, the instrument just isn’t an issue. And that’s true of the children of many very conservative Churches of Christ. In an age when the Bible is available in easy-to-read contemporary English, and when the struggle against the world is vastly more important than the church’s internal struggles, our kids are just not persuaded that we need to divide over the instrument.


And this means that they’ll find a church that helps them grow in faith and serve Christ without regard to the instrument. And a church that’s entirely a cappella may well appear legalistic to the eyes of a young man or woman, even if the church teaches the true gospel. They will look for churches that practice what they preach — including unity and including presenting the gospel in terms of the local culture.

I’m not saying that an instrumental service is essential to a church today. Rather, I’m saying —

  • Actively and visibly fellowshipping instrumental churches is essential to being the church God calls us to

  • Choosing to be exclusively a cappella because your members are too legalistic to permit it means you have some serious teaching to do/

  • If the world is searching for nondenominational Christianity that puts scripture above tradition and works of service above doctrinal disputation, then God has answered the prayers of the Restoration Movement. We should join in the work of God by making as many churches of this kind as possible.



Jay GuinJay Guin is the author of The Holy Spirit and Revolutionary Grace: God’s antidotes for division within the Churches of Christ and the blog He graduated from David Lipscomb College in 1975 and the University of Alabama School of Law in 1978. He now practices law in Tuscaloosa, Alabama.

Reviewed: trying to make the Spirit OF Christ into another "person" with "his" own center of consciousness and IN ADDITION to Jesus Christ who returned to God and received the Holy Spirit in His post resurrection state, also RETURNED on the day of Pentecost and "HE" shed forth what you see and hear.  John brands as anti-christ those who reject

The One God in Heaven
And Jesus of Nazareth whom God made to be both Lord and Christ as the prophesied "seed" of Abraham.
The ONE mediator between God and man is the man Jesus Christ in His glorified state. We will also see Him as He IS.

Jay is an elder with the University Church of Christ and married to Denise Hendrix Guin, with four sons, Chris, Jonathan, Tyler, and Philip.

Jay can be contacted at [].

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