The Jesus Proposal : Rubel Shelly and John York

The Jesus Proposal: A Theological Framework for Maintaining the Unity of the Body of Christ. Rubel Shelly, John York and a small band of men selling books propose to achieve UNITY by abandoning ALL Christian principles a doctrines.

"Conquering tribes of herdsmen established themselves as ruling aristocracies and then decayed,

each of them in turn bringing new languages and new religious beliefs;

urban merchants and money-lenders
devised methods of exploiting the food-producers
and tried to impose their own rationalistic modes of thinking."

"Prior to the spread of the commercial and industrial revolutions there was no essential change in agricultural techniques; and although the original

neolithic fertility rituals, cleansed of their more barbaric elements and adapted to the worship of new gods,

gradually faded into popular festivals and folk tales and finally into children's games,

the beliefs associated with them retained much of their vitality." (Parkes, Henry Bamford, Gods and Men The Origins of Western Culture, p. 49, Knopf)

See Rubel Shelly silencing Jesus who never taught JUST JESUS. Baptism Repudiated because the writers have never read the entire sweep of Baptism typified by the flood and the Red Sea, and prophesied in several passages as connected to receiving A holy spirit or A clear conscience. Without this, it is not possible for one to come boldly before the throne of Grace into which NO SINGER or NO MUSICIAN or NO RHETORICIAN or Sophist would dare to go. Under Christ, this new PLACE is the human spirit where all worship takes place without musical or rhetorical mediators.

If you have a 1 ad gold coin with Caesar's image on it now 2000 years later; and if you turn it in the GOLD CONTENT will be roughly equivalent to the first century (neglecting collector's value). Let's say that the coin was in the Judas Bag (to hold mouthpieces of wind instruments) and was used to purchase food for Jesus.

However, if you shine a flashlight on the coin you cause a CHARISMATIC FIT to take place among the electrons. The very light hitting of an electron by a photon will cause it to move. If Jesus touched it He rubbed electrons off the surface. Rubel Shelly and the whole band of Philosophers having discovered the Philosopher's stone use this to claim that YOU see the coin with YOUR evolved EYES and does not have the same meaning

Even groping scientists believed that YOU saw by projecting something out of your self.

WE do not PROJECT Divine authority from our COLORED GLASSES. Even in the old, obsolete MODERN period when I was born, people were SEEING things as they ARE, at the same time Heisenberg was saying, BUT, you cannot SEE electrons. And you could never and will never see electrons but that is NOT to say that the electrons in Great Grand Mother's spinning wheel have GONE OBSOLETE in according to the Shelly Law. If I had a 2,000 year old spinning wheel it would STILL mean the same thing to me and it would still spin wool.

Therefore, there is no way to LOOK at an electron without causing it to move. However, the very meaning of the CLAIM to scholarship is that we can read the texts of the Bible. The OLD laws of sending a space ship to Mars still work:

THE P.S. (Pre Shelly) LAW

BUT THE P.S. (Post Shelly) LAW WHICH HE UNDERSTANDS SO COMPLETELY THAT HE IS WILLING TO CALL GOD A LIAR BY NOT BEING ABLE TO SPEAK LONG DISTANCE TO US. Is particles become waves and radiate out into space, the same law existed in the garden of Eden known but by God:

I spent a quarter in Engineering College seeing how this equation is derived and it is still Greek to me. I noticed that if I turned in highly complicated derivations, I got an F for not following THE LAW OF ADDING NUMBERS small numbers.

I knew a man who attended the Nashville School of the Bible: the only evangelist I ever knew. He owned land which came from a grant written on parchment (sheep skin) and signed by Andy Jackson. If Rubel Shelly had such a document HE would insist that Andy Jackson had the eartly power to make a lasting docume. And yet, Rubel Shelly and John York insist that God COULD NOT.

If you believe that Don Finto went to Roswell, saw little men and heard them speak to him, then you can believe that Rubel Shelly MUST claim supernatural power if he INSISTS that the Bible is fatally flawed because different writers reported their--never chronological--eye witness account which Rubel Shelly denies.


Rubel Shelly and John York: How do I make sense of Jesus going back and forth, back and forth between Galilee and Jerusalem in John's account

when he never goes to Jerusalem in Matthew, Mark, and Luke until the very end of his ministry?

The synoptic gospels never pretend to be chronological but a collection of the teachings of Jesus. Not every writer was witness to every event. Indeed, many other similar events may have occured.

The important point is that however flawed they think it is, the BIBLE clearly teaches against MUSIC and reveals Baptism as prophesied and fulfilled. There is no ADVANTAGE unless you say that what we read as DIRECT COMMANDS no longer mean direct commands because the Heisenberg Uncertainty Principle will not let out NEW GLASSES see exactly what it was that God was TRYING to communicate.

The Pharisees held the same belief: surely modern times in Jerusalem (Sodom) MUST have new acts of worship to SILENCE the Old Testament. They simply could not PEDDLE

Jesus "fired" the doctors of the Law and Paul identified the MANY looking for wages as Robbers. Trying to justify the LOCATED MISSIONARY by Timothy, Rubel Shelly misses a CLEAR statement that Timothy must WORK and he must provide CHARITY or the Agapae feeding of the destitute on their way to work: Not, a feast of the wealthy where the Lord's Supper is observed with SWINE FLESH in the teeth: Sure, Shelly said that Jesus would do BARBECUE.

CLAIMING TO BE "GODS STANDING IN THE HOLY PLACE" to which no sOHISTs (serpents), singers or musicians could go without being SACRIFICED.

But the objective truth in the Bible is NOT what John had in mind:

Rubel Shelly John York: But that's not the witness, the testimony John wants me to confirm.

What I am called to affirm with the

witness of my own life is that authenticating Spirit-presence

that reveals itself when I keep heaven's commandments here on earth, live the from-above life in my down-below setting.

The Holy Spirit has a name: Jesus Christ or Jesus of Nazareth. That spirit would lifte the presumptious performing preachers by the hair and fling them out as he CAST OUT the musical worship teams--like dung. The Greek world and Jesus and Paul recognized TRAINED SPEAKERS as sorcerers and parasites. That is the SPIRIT which rebukes those who TAKE A WAGE to ride on the backs of widows and hard working honest people while repudiating what they believe.

Charles Spurgeon: I am told that many in the Church of England preach against her own teaching. I know they do, and herein I rejoice in their enlightenment, but I question, gravely question their morality. To take oath that I sincerely assent and consent to a doctrine which I do not believe, would to my conscience appear little short of perjury, if not absolute downright perjury; but those who do so must be judged by their own Lord. For me to take money for defending what I do not believe--for me to take the money of a Church, and then to preach against what are most evidently its doctrines--I say for me to do this (I judge others as I would that they should judge me) for me, or for any other simple, honest man to do so, were an atrocity so great, that if I had perpetrated the deed, I should consider myself out of the pale of truthfulness, honesty, and common morality. Sirs, when I accepted the office of minister of this congregation, I looked to see what were your articles of faith; if I had not believed them I should not have accepted your call, and when I change my opinions, rest assured that as an honest man I shall resign the office, for how could I profess one thing in your declaration of faith, and quite another thing in my own preaching? Would I accept your pay, and then stand up every Sabbath-day and talk against the doctrines of your standards? For clergymen to swear or say that they give their solemn assent and consent to what they do not believe is one of the grossest pieces of immorality perpetrated in England, and is most pestilential in its influence, since it directly teaches men to lie whenever it seems necessary to do so in order to get a living or increase their supposed usefulness: it is in fact an open testimony from priestly lips that at least in ecclesiastical matters falsehood may express truth, and truth itself is a mere unimportant nonentity. I know of nothing more calculated to debauch the public mind than a want of straightforwardness in ministers; and when worldly men hear ministers denouncing the very things which their own Prayer Book teaches, they imagine that words have no meaning among ecclesiastics, and that vital differences in religion are merely a matter of tweedle-dee and tweedle-dum, and that it does not much matter what a man does believe so long as he is charitable towards other people.

If it sounds insane, it is: Experience and Authority in Religion

"Of the several religious leaders we profile in The Death of Truth, most explicitly say that personal experience is the key to understanding religion. Most also call for dissociation as a preface to the religious experience. Dissociation is the loss of conscious awareness of the real world. Specifically, postmodern religionists call for people to leave all rational categories behind before ascending to the godhead. Thus, they see one thing as the supreme barrier to deep religion: Reason, and its handmaiden, truth.


Hugh Ross notes: They went on to propose that just as the behavior of a hydrogen atom can be described by a quantum mechanical wave function, so might the behavior of the universe. If that is the case, they claimed, the universe could have just popped into existence out of absolutely nothing at what most would call the beginning of time.

This fanciful "hypothesis" provides the basis for Hawking's widely quoted statement, "The universe would not be created, not be destroyed; it would simply be.

What place, then, for a Creator?"

It is the basis, too, for New Agers' and atheists' claims that a personal Creator-God need not, according to science, be the agency for the origin of the universe. To Hawking's credit, he admits in this more recent work that the whole idea is "just a proposal: it cannot be deduced from some other principle."

Hawkins "goes on to conclude that "with the success of scientific theories in describing events, most people have come to believe that God allows the universe to evolve according to a set of laws and does not intervene in the universe to break these laws."

The postmodern concept began as a joke but it was adopted so completely that we now have moved into another DIMENSION. Quantum mechanics, about which Shelly and York know nothing, is ready at hand to teach a NEW AGE claim that there are no correct doctrines. But, Hawking, doing his silent laugy says, it was JUST A PROPOSAL: it cannot be deduced from other principles.

However, Heisenberg in 1927 decided that you cannot "measure a microbe with a yardstick." But, those who repudiate the Word will even take a JOKE to fool the fools as a handy tool to ridicule Bible believers even as they RIDE on the backs of the widows and hard workers they getting rich from by saying:

You cannot see the creatures on a mite's eyebrow.

Therefore, you cannot see the Word of God in words half an inch long.

Do they believe it? Who knows, but Jesus said that the sons of the Devil speak on their own.

But, Ross continues: The most fundamental contradiction between Hawking's philosophy and Biblical Christianity (not to mention physical reality) is Hawking's belief that man can discover that "complete set of laws." By this, he means not just a complete and consistent unified field theory but "a complete understanding of the events around us, and of our own existence." Elsewhere he has said that he wants to "know the mind of God." Since the existence of the God of the Bible or singularities would guarantee that his goal would never be reached, he seeks to deny both.

Rubel Shelly John York: Just get us humans more interested in our differences and distinctions than in our common ground and similarities in Christ, and the church remains the devil's playground.

One Exception

Strangely, it turns out that one exception is allowed to this universal prohibition against intolerance. For some reason, it's okay to question and even denounce religious views when dealing with what is pejoratively labeled "fundamentalism." Today, when people refer to "fundamentalists" they no longer mean just religious extremists like the Shiites waging holy war against the West.

Today, fundamentalism may refer to anyone who claims to know truth or who charges another religion with falsehood.

Fundamentalists are in the wrong because they subscribe to universal truth claims (metanarratives), and are therefore "totalistic," or "logocentric," in their thinking.

Watch out for Pacifists: they will kill you!

First, questioning another's beliefs implies that we can refer to an external objective reality, when in fact, reality is a social construct. By trying to apply rationality to religion, we are really trying to impose enlightenment European culture onto others.

Also, by challenging the truth claims of another's religion, we devalue the person who is the source of his or her own truth.

That's what Rubel Shelly and John York are saying. If you use the BIBLE then you are satanic because John didn't even write to reveal objective truth.

Therefore, WE are the source of all truth. This is a SPIRITISTS approach common with all pagans:

Although it is tempting to think these two outlooks have borrowed, one from the other, this is apparently not the case. Instead, they are compatible outlooks which have made common cause in popular culture, often blended with native spiritualities and New Age consciousness. Remember, tribal nature religions also make no use of reason in their paths to knowledge of the world. These religions rely on tradition and intuition for know spiritual things, none of which can be tested in any way by reason.

The pagan prophetesses were never trusted when sober or in their right mind. For instance, the uncovered prophesiers of 1 Cor 11:5 sang and played instruments and carried a NEW WINESKIN. They drove themselves insane with drugs or music and heard the VOICE OF ANGELS. H. Bamford in Of Gods and men:

"The development both of religion and of the arts can be traced back in a continuous line to the hunting era. The group ritual of the primeval tribesmen were the origin not only of all religious ceremonial, but also of the drama and of poetry and music, while magic gave birth to the visual arts." (Parkes, p. 30).

"Awed by the mysteries of his own spirit no less than by those of nature, primitive man was likely to attribute to divine influence

any abnormal emotional state, whether above or below the usual level. Medicine men customarily went into states of trance in which they were believed to be in communication with the gods,

and many tribes supposed lunatics and sexual deviants to be divinely possessed.

As proof that they are Standing the Holy Places, Rubel Shelly and John York claim that the DEVIL is the leader of those who hold the clear, Biblical view of baptism which Mark says was the beginning of the Gospel or the CORNER of the ARCHE beginning after you understand the PROTOS understanding of the death, burial and resurrection of Jesus Christ. Baptism is the ARCHE or the CORNER where WE take hold of the PROTOTYPE.

We are NOT God and therefore have no mandate to make everyone AGREE by destroying the very essentials of the Biblical Doctrine. True Doctrine guarantees that we will be DESPISED AND REJECTED BY MEN. If a preacher cannot stand that then he is not YET A SUFFERING DISCIPLE. The Hebrew nation brought several millions out of Egypt. Because they wanted to worship like the CANAANITES there were about 5,000 who obeyed the GOSPEL in being baptized. The REMNANT is tiny and the lust to get in bed with the MAJORITY is to guarantee that Satan is the leader.

The Bible identifies two major things preached by the devil and his children or agents. Rubel Shelly preaches the CORE GOSPEL and declares that the BIBLE WRITERS wrote based on their CULTURE and their own agenda. This means that there are only SEVEN FACTS about Jesus which can be used. This has recently been stripped down to Just-Jesus which must be Anti-Christ. Jesus said that this conclusion is reached only listening to the Devil.

Here is what Jame's Melton calls SATAN'S FAVORITE BIBLE VERSE.

Now when they heard this, they were pricked in their heart, and said unto Peter and to the rest of the apostles, Men and brethren,

what shall we do? Acts 2:37

Then Peter said unto them,

Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost. Acts 2:38

Rubel Shelly will say that the church is the DEVIL'S PLAYGROUND. The SECOND threat is the rise of the MUSICAL LOCUSTS as prophesied. It is a fact that the Bible and secular history proves that MUSIC came with Lucifer or the devil including wind, string and percussion instruments.

Son of man, take up a lamentation upon the king of Tyrus, and say unto him, Thus saith the Lord God; Thou sealest up the sum, full of wisdom, and perfect in beauty. Ezek 28:12

Thou hast been in Eden the garden of God; every precious stone was thy covering, the sardius, topaz, and the diamond, the beryl, the onyx, and the jasper, the sapphire, the emerald, and the carbuncle, and gold: the workmanship of thy tabrets and of thy pipes was prepared in thee in the day that thou wast created. Ezek 28:13

Thou art the anointed cherub that covereth; and I have set thee so: thou wast upon the holy mountain of God; thou hast walked up and down in the midst of the stones of fire. Ezek 28:14

The Pharisees, Scribes and Hypocrites (Sectarian singers, preachers, actors) are children of their father, the devil, becase THEY SPEAK ON THEIR OWN. Why do they do that? They say that the HEISENBERG UNCERTAINTY PRINCIPLE means that YOU cannot read the Bible without changing it from its original. But, it is ok for US to take an unholy wage and ride on the backs of widows and hard working people to tell you: I HAVE NOTHING TO TELL YOU but my OWN experience.


But now ye seek to kill me, a man that hath told you the truth, which I have heard of God: this did not Abraham. John 8:40

Ye do the deeds of your father. Then said they to him, We be not born of fornication; we have one Father, even God. John 8: 41

Jesus said unto them, If God were your Father, ye would love me: for I proceeded forth and came from God; neither came I of myself, but he sent me. John 8: 42

Why do ye not understand my speech? even because ye cannot hear my word. John 8: 43

Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it. John 8: 44

The SECOND threat is the rise of the MUSICAL LOCUSTS as prophesied. It is a fact that the Bible and secular history proves that MUSIC came with Lucifer or the devil including wind, string and percussion instruments.

The Pharisees, Scribes and Hypocrites (Sectarian singers, preachers, actors) are children of their father, the devil, becase THEY SPEAK ON THEIR OWN. Why do they do that? They say that the HEISENBERG UNCERTAINTY PRINCIPLE means that YOU cannot read the Bible without changing it from its original. But, it is ok for US to take an unholy wage and ride on the backs of widows and hard working people to tell you: I HAVE NOTHING TO TELL YOU but my OWN experience.


HERE IS THE UNCERTAINTY PRINCIPLE. God's Word lasted from Abraham to Jesus but the clergy had LUST and TRAFFICK so that the truth COULD NOT penetrate.

Rubel Shelly John York: Living With a New Paradigm

Meanwhile, at the dawn of the twenty-first century, the world has shifted. The certainty with which we understood the laws of nature and

the science of objective truth
have been undermined by
new discoveries.

Not up here in the MACRO world where WE live. If you are not a sub-atomic particle then the statement has no meaning.

Only the Devil could make one a liar and a repudiator of God's power to preserve His Word through Himself as the LIVING WORD or Holy Spirit.

Because a flashlight can turn electrons into waves (too SMALL for Rubel Shelly's NEW GLASSSES for getting a NEW VISION of the church, before he can be the NEW HOLY SPIRIT he CLAIMS that Newton's law aboug jumping off tall buildings no longer applies. Therefore, by UNDERSTANDING Maxwell's wave and the Heisenburg Uncertainty Principle, Rubel Shelly is willing to be the MASTER Sower of Discord among once- brethren:

By the power of God, I DEMAND that Rubel Shelly write another book and defend his FALSE CLAIM that this NEW EQUATION invalidates the OLD BIBLE and the OLD CHURCH.

The world operates on the SAME RULES as the last day of 1999. Satan wants us to believe that the bible and the DOCTRINES which Jesus taught don't matter any more. Even if the culture shifts, God does not. Both Paul and Peter laid down the inspired and recorded Word of God as the MARK. The only way we can tell that false teachers have shifted is that they no longer even discuss the Bible but dismiss it in favor of THEIR OWN new legalistic dogmas. The OLD churches were not LEGALISTICALLY BURDEN with a huge staff, music as the most legalistic, works-intensive thing one can PERFORM as worship, massive programs like that God warned that human kings would IMPOSE. It is the NEW churches which are the musical SECTARIANS.

The only arena which we were NEVER SURE OF is an area which we are still NOT SURE OF. That is the sub-atomic world of electrons, protons, neutrons and other much smaller objects. However, we DO KNOW how the electron works and that means that we DO NOT stick our finger in a wall socket.

The ONLY thing we cannot be sure about, is the location and state of those elements. The sub-atomic particles, however, are STILL THERE in a Bible manuscript of Isaiah after over 2,000 years. We can read Isaiah of the SAME parchment the SCRIBE lived with as he COPIED older scrolls of Isaiah.

The same particles in my Great-Great grandmother's spinning wheel are still there: she could sit down and spin cotton and it would work EXACTLY as it did when she spun for my Great Grand Father. His picture is still about the same.

Therefore, what are Rubel Shelly and John York trying to TRAFFICK? They are saying that EVEN GOD cannot tell the truth and preserve the truth. Why? Because He made us FLAWED. We are not able to read what He revealed to Moses. When? Why, in the 21st century the fabrice of time and space fell apart and even God was not able to bridge the Gap without using mercinaries to reveal the NEW documents of Truth. Is that a fact? Certainly, Rubel Shelly and John York say that "work out our own salvation" means that THEY working in partnership with GOD derived the Scriptures for THEIR CULTURE. However, culture has changed and WE have to partner with God to surface a new BIBLE to fit OUR culture.

Rubel Shelly and John York: Neither is there anything that challenges the divine order in creation by having women partner with males in serving God.

So isn't it at least possible that there could be cultural conditioning at work in some of the statements about how men and women function in the life of the church?

And couldn't Christians disagree in good faith about the interpretation of these statements without any party to the discussion jettisoning a high view of Scripture as the Word of God?

The same message of Paul also restricts rhetoricians or in Paul's words, super apostles. If the men would sit down and shut up the women would not lust be be a public performer. You remember that Jesus stood up to read the text for the say and then had the uncommon decency to SIT DOWN. The pulpit was to hold up the Bible and NOT the preacher who was restricted from doing what modern sermonic performers do.

Henry George Liddell, Robert Scott, A Greek-English Lexicon

Huperlian , Adv. beyond measure, exceedingly, sophos Eust.1396.42; to hu. Id.1184.18 ; hoi hu. apostoloi the 'super-Apostles', 2 Ep.Cor. 11.5, 12.11.


I. properly, skilled in any handicraft or art, cunning in his craft, Theogn., etc; of a charioteer, Pind.; of poets and musicians, id=Pind.; of a soothsayer, Soph., etc.

2. clever in matters of common life, wise, prudent, shrewd, s. andres Thessaloi shrewd fellows, the Thessalians! Hdt.; polla sophos Aesch.; meizô sophian sophos Plat., etc.; tôn sophôn kreissô better than all craft, Soph.; sophon [esti] c. inf., Eur.

OPHIS-teia, sophistry, mantikê, of Balaam, mantikê means divination, soothsayer

Playto, Cratylus says "the part of appropriative, coercive, hunting art which hunts animals, land animals, tame animals, man, privately, for pay, is paid in cash, claims to give education, and is a hunt after rich and promising youths, must--so our present argument concludes--be called sophistry.

With the dawn of the internet false preachers see their SELF-INVENTED OCCUPATION in danger. History knows that it has always been disenfranchised preachers and woman followers who create RELIGION to replace the masculine synagogue or school of the Bible.

In Narrative Theology, the Bible IS NOT the Word of God. It is the story of of God through purely human eyes. While the Bible has been sifted down to seven facts ABOUT Jesus and the Just-Jesus, we can TAKE LIBERTIES (sez Rubel Shelly and John York) to write our OWN story. According to many in the same scam, we can BE the Moses or Jesus for our time.

John York: Remember, our fundamental conviction is that the Bible is the story of God,

a dramatic narrative that announces and reveals and invites us into participation and relationship with God and one another.

The REAL Bible does not need, CANNOT TOLERATE humans in participating with Him: we are to listen, learn and obey. God is God and we are not. Therefore, to claim to participate with God in revealing the word FOR OUR CULTURE cannot have the slightest grasp of the meaning of God and therefore cannot be in relationship with God.

Because most have never read the entire Bible for meaning, it is easy to claim that God had no purpose of revealing divine doctrine without which mankind cannot have a relationship with God. We do not participate in the unfolding of the Constitution. However, we participae in enjoying the rights procured by the writing, blood and tears of the founders.

God is God and John York is not: the distance between the two is INFINITE. Man cannot be a co-agent of God in revealing truth.

Every scene in that story has been set in some historical human context. [Is that profound or what?]

Those cultural settings always have been changing and changeable.

Rubel Shelly John York: The age of technology, with its notion of our universe as one giant well-oiled machine, has heen confronted with some new realities. One writer puts it this way:

Not even the Babylonians thought of the world as a well-oiled machine. The planets or Wandering Stars upset that view of an unchanging universe. This is why STARS are still worshiped because they WANDER as false prophets and most of the world would sacrifice their lives to be able to her FALSEHOOD.

In the contemporaneous literature, Book of Enoch, Book of Jubilees and the Books of Adam and Even show that the FALLEN STARS were the angels led astray by Lucifer who came to earth as the HARP-PLAYING PROSTITUTE. Because they upset the equilibrium

Rubel Shelly John York: With the development of quantum physics, we discovered a world that did not behave the way Newton said it should. It was impossible to pin down, with waves turning into particles and particles into waves. Which had mass one moment was pure energy the next, and none of it was predictable. p 30

Steven Hawkins acknowledges two unavoidable limitations on man's quest for more scientific knowledge:

1) the limitation of the Heisenberg uncertainty principle of quantum mechanics (the impossibility for the human observer to measure exactly both the position and the momentum of any quantum entity), and

2) the impossibility of solving exactly all but the very simplest of physical equations

This has NOTHING to do with what Rubel Shelly and John York can OBSERVE or even have a minimal grasp. This works at the sub-atomic level and has NOTHING to do with Newtonian laws. Things still fall DOWN and smoke still RISES from the their own consuming breath. A word written on paper will never dodge and weave. It will never become pure energy and will neve wave unless it is wavering false prophets.

Rubel Shelly John York: The very act of observing a particle CHANGED its behavior, which destroyed the whole notion of scientific OBJECTIVE. A scientist could not stand outside the world to watch it.

The Same particles that were busy responding to each other responded to the watcher as well,

revealing a world that was not made up of manageable things but of constantly changing relationships. It is no longer possible to think of the world as a machine.

No. That is an untruth. This has NOTHING to do above the sub-atomic particle level. A two thousand year old parchment has been ATTACKED by outside particles which changed the electrons in the ink. However, we can still read the document to say what it said to an Esssene. It is DISHONEST to use what happens in the almost infinitessimally small world of the atoms and MAKE IT SEEM that not even GOD can deliver His Word to us: just by LOOKING at the page we make it change. Utter nonsense. Lock 'em up.

With the moronic grasp of the village idiot who has learned about snow on the slopes of mountains he constructs a vast network of wartime experiences which never occured.

What the would be scientists do not know that you WATCH an electron by bombarding it with another electron. By analogy you WATCH a bowling ball by sending another bowling ball to determin its POSITION in the dark. But, in the process you MOVE they ball by PROJECTING your object.

This is like the old superstition, which Shelly and York seem to believe in, just by looking at a book you PROJECT something from your eyeballs. In the process, you move the object so that you cannot be sure of where it is.

When you read the OBJECTIVE words in the Bible you DO NOT see them through your cultural eyeballs. You simply choose to CHANGE what you see into something else. That is, you are a liar but God does not give us a moving target which we CANNOT understand.

Consciousness and Reality

Postmodern thought also dovetails neatly another feature of New Age Consciousness: The way consciousness can create or alter reality. In New Age religion, mental imaging can create new realities,

not unlike the way affirmative postmodernists hope to create new realities.

Although New Age thinkers have not thus far demonstrated the fascination with political power seen in postmodern circles, they also favor oppressed tribal peoples as more pure than western culture.

See how Rubel Shelly and Lynn Anderson revision the church much like the Methodist feminists and lesbian professors and "pastors." History know this as FEMINISTS hermeneutics which Caroll D. Osburn favors as a way to destroy patriarchal (God the father-God the Son) by "little acts of TREASON.'

Ross: Attacks by physicists and other scientists on the God of the Bible are not new. The Bible seems an affront to their intellectual prowess. This ancient "religious" document makes many pointed and challenging statements about cosmic origins. As Britain's Sir Fred Hoyle points out, "There is a good deal of cosmology in the Bible."

Nothing which can be seen with a microscope or LARGER gets pushed around by the OBSERVER'S tools. Certainly nothing as large as a book or the letters or the dots are affected by the OBSERVER.

To say that one cannot understand the objective word of God without imposing our own views does not speak of those not UNDER THE INFLUENCE of heretical pals or professors.

Therefore, the WHOLE THESIS of this book is sick science and any conclusion which says that WE can sell you truth but YOU cannot understand it is false.

Narrative Theology MUST CONFESS that the God of the Bible is unable to communicate with mankind through His Word. However, they admit, "FOR A PRICE I will tell you what you must do: you must REJECT the Word of God."

The very act of a SUB-ATOMIC particle hitting another SUB-ATOMIC particle will MOVE but only because the LOOKED AT particle is about the size of the LOOKING particle. If a ball a foot in diameter is examined by bounching a ball a foot diameter off its surface, we cannot be sure of its location. But if we measure the bounce of ball bearings we can determing the size and location of the larger ball.

Rubel Shelly John York: What does any of that say about the future of denominations and hair-splitting divisions in the church In the world of institutional church--where the church was viewed as a giant machine--the pursuit of a "better machine" seemed to make sense.

It says ABSOLUTELY NOTHING. However, we do not have to SHOOT particles at the Word of God. God made our RESOLVING POWER or our eyes so sharp that we can see a very small word on paper.

That means that if God inspired His Word it can be understood and it will not change.

However, Jesus warned that the Jewish clergy COULD NOT either see, hear or understand His Word. Now, then, why would I want to hire one of these to whom Jesus refused to speak except in parables to GUIDE ME INTO ALL TRUTH.

Unless you are an ELECTRON or other sub-atomic particle NEWTON works very well. You can project out an satallite which has to swing around the earth a time or two and then BE at the same place MARS will be three years later and totally depend on NEWTON without even caring about the uncertainty principle

John York and Rubel Shelly can grasp at this to DESTROY FAITH in the Bible only because THEY as sub-level scholars have been HIT by something which turns them into a PARTICLE teaching the Word into a WAVE promoting the music of the SPHERES.

One of the prophesied dangers of a CLERGY where the SECTARIAN rhetoricians, sOPHISts, singers and musicians are known as sorcerers and PARASITES it that they cannot help SELLING the Word of God "as it has been taught" because they see "godliness as a means of financial game.

There is more money in a theology of the FLAT EARTH SOCIETY than the gospel.

The Heisenberg uncertainty principle was developed in 1927: back in what Shelly hallucinates was the MODERN age where UP meant up and DOWN meant down with no uncertainty.

This applies ONLY at the sub atomic level. For instance, a simple atom is made up of one proton and one electronic. With Light waves you cannot "SEE" at that level. By shooting an electron at the atom you can SEE the electron but the SHOCK of being hit by an electron makes the target electron bounce away. Therefore, there is no particle small enough to shoot at the atom without moving the electron from its position.

This DOES NOT mean that the electron is uncertain of ITSELF. The same electrons created by God HAVE NOT CHANGED because Heisenberg MOVED them when he tried to SEE them.

None of this applies to the MACRO world. For instance, if Heisenberg was resurrrected, he could find his way to the same German town he left because the TOWN is not UNCERTAIN of itself.

Shelly and York want to play SCIENTIST and apply the uncertainty of sub-atomic particles to BIBLICAL TRUTH. They ask, like clowns, if we cannot be certain about WHERE the electron is at any time, how can we believe that BELIEVE still means BELIEVE and BAPTISM still means BAPTISM. We believe what we WANT to believe but the OBJECTIVE truth never MOVES because it is read by EYES which have, they laughingly believe, are governed by the sub-atomic world. Photons are BIG ENOUGH that when they HIT a barn they CANNOT introduce any uncertainty. The barn means the same thing to me as the man who built my perhaps a century ago.

It is beyond redemption to PREACH that the God of the universe who created light waves and human eyes CANNOT reveal eternal truth.

Shelly and York, YOUR eyes and MINDS would need mega-mega volts of a Super-conducting, Super-Collider at maybe half a billion dollars to LOOK and TEACH the Word of God and MOVE its God-given meaning or make it ENDORSE the waves of MUSIC.

Rubel Shelly Index of sermon and book reviews.

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